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Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

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131–140 of 267 posts

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#131

As a Windows system and user-mode dev, I absolutely never understand these sorts of drive-by posts with nearly zero technical depth. If there is one thing about Windows that is really good, it is its kernel and driver architecture, and absolute plethora of user-mode libraries that come with the OS , that can be programmed against with a variety of languages from ancient to brand-new, all maintained by the vendor. Doi…

> and I still maintain that Vista was OK; its problems were due to Intel strong-arming MS into certifying a broken version of Vista for its sub-par integrated GPUs of the time

Nah, it was "Vista Ready" bullshit to "certify" the utter bullshit of 512Mb RAM and 5000RPM (for the notebooks) machines already built and mostly shipped by the late 2006. Of course it ran like shit if it needed to be in the swap 95% of the time. It's even more drastic if you look at the DRAM market at the time - DDR was dead, DDR2 provided the solution to finally bring to the consumer market a cheap 4/8GB RAM machines from the OTS consumer components and DDR3 was right around the corner.

> People complain you 'cannot create local user accounts any more'.

Also people forgot on how you needed a computer with iTunes for the first use of iPad - otherwise it wouldn't work. Or how the only way to use some Android phones without a Google account you literally needed to take out the SIM card or otherwise you had no way to skip "enter your google account or register one" (reminds anything?) and this was years before current situation.

Sure, MS or more likely some brain-dead manager with the the only KPI in his empty head would push for a total block of the local accounts without some enterprise (Entra?) shitfuck workaround but that would still take some time.

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#133

As a Windows system and user-mode dev, I absolutely never understand these sorts of drive-by posts with nearly zero technical depth. If there is one thing about Windows that is really good, it is its kernel and driver architecture, and absolute plethora of user-mode libraries that come with the OS , that can be programmed against with a variety of languages from ancient to brand-new, all maintained by the vendor. Doi…

We are now at the point where the average PC user can configure linux to their liking but it takes a windows sys admin with strong domain knowledge to configure windows to their liking. Im a windows sysadmin(pretty shit one but still) and I struggle to remove a lot of the w11 features and have been unable to get it working how it used to.

Average PC user doesn't even know what an OS is. All they know is clicking certain icons. Newer GUIs are designed to be anti-intellectual. It has started to gain speed with iPhones and has been consistently worse.

What you remove/configure also depends on what you expect. Windows and its ecosystem is GUI-first so I can do most of my customizations using a GUI app like Winaero Tweaker. I can use Powershell to remove certain Windows components too. It usually takes 1 or 2 hours and it stays as it is even with semiannual updates.

With Linux systems I spend much more time to bend it to my wishes but the whole design philosophy is off. Most of the configuration doesn't give proper feedback. It sometimes half works. The API churn rate in Linux world is higher (a lot lower with KDE, to give them the credit). Package management is great. However you don't actually get to choose. Browsers use GTK APIs and cairo, I dislike the libraries (especially the font rendering) but have no choice unless I want to port browsers. I dislike CSDs, again no choice especially with how Wayland turned out (basically CSDs are default, apps opt-in to SSDs). Many things that can have good GUIs are terminal based. The existing GUIs break often. So it quickly turns into me fighting the basics.

I learned a lot from trying to make Linux my desktop and debugging driver issues from ATI cards (anyone remembers fglrx and editing Xorg config?) to Nvidia ones. I used Linux as my primary desktop between 2008 and 2020. I developed many software on it and still earn my living from embedded Linux stuff (I use WSL2 nowadays). However more I look into Linux's "engineering" more I hate it.

If I really want it, I need to spend some serious development time creating a more Windows-like OS out of Linux starting from libc and go up. I dislike almost every library I read the source from Linux world, especially GNU and GNOME ones. I like Qt and KDE's software architecture but the anything below (maybe except systemd) is off. Maybe Redox is a better target for this effort but I need a working system for my desktop now.

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#134
post #63

I'll consider switching to Linux when the GUI becomes as configurable as Windows 10 or earlier. For example, this is my taskbar layout: https://i.ibb.co/1GqKH27L/taskbar-layout.png To my knowledge, it's not possible to achieve anything like this layout on Windows 11, Linux or Mac. I did try it in various Linux distros a few times but frankly got sick of navigating the maze of window managers et cetera. I think someth…

Windows user and developer for nearly 30 years and migrated my thinkpad from windows 11 to Kubuntu a few days ago with almost zero friction and got my desktop exactly as I had it on windows, did a lazy write up here => https://rodyne.com/?p=3486 - I wont be going back even if Microsoft does release "Lindoze"

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#135

The "Microsoft Tax" is often cheaper than the "Linux Engineering Salary." While Linux alternatives exist, they require "assembly"—integrating LDAP, Kerberos, DNS, and config management (Ansible/Salt) to do what AD does out of the box. Most businesses don't want to be in the business of maintaining their own identity infrastructure. They want a utility. Between Group Policy’s granular control over the endpoint and the…

I am a sysadmin and Group Policy is the entire moat Microsoft has. Linux has nothing like it, and it probably can't because it requires a level of top down authority over a platform's design and implementation that would be hard in the Linux space. Maybe something like systemd could do something similar which defined policy over all the components they've taken over, but a distro doing it would be pointless, we're no…

The present future of top down Linux management is NixOS. Who knows what the eventual future will be. ;)

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#137
I think there’s even odds Microsoft does this. The cost savings would be immense.

This ignores the fundamental problem: Microsoft has poor taste. It’s everywhere. Cloud products to operating systems. After peaking in 2010 or so, their products have declined to the point that I’ll do anything to avoid using or interacting with them.

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> WinNT drivers are not things of beauty. The dev experience is cranky, and validation is a nightmare I think one could say the same for any platform; in general, developing drivers is just difficult, full stop. That driver quality for peripherals can be bad is not the fault of the platform. I'm sure I could find dodgy drivers in the Linux tree that were merged in only because ' shrug it makes PineappleCorp's device…

Well, these days it seems Linux drivers get enough eye-balls on them that anything meaningful is going to get looked at. Sure, I expect there are some low usage drivers in the repo that just haven't had enough mileage. At least with Linux I can see the driver code. (The second day at my current job, somebody pointed me at a bug with an obscure symptom. A quick check of a log file showed a 0xE exception. A couple hour…

At the dayjob we have lots of sporadic problems with USB drivers of Linux in our fleet of embedded devices (RPi). I had a lot of problems with USB-C and Thunderbolt docks in last 5 years. If USB doesn't get enough eyes to not crash/freeze systems entirely, I don't know what else would get. Monolithic kernel design should have belonged to past but we don't get nice things.

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#139

Besides of the advantages and disadvantages of Linux and/or Windows on this, the problem I see on a Microsoft Linux distribution is not the Linux part, but the Microsoft one. The problem that is driving away users are the company policies, not what the OS can or not do, they were mostly OK with how things were in previous version. So putting the Microsoft policies in a Linux desktop will probably have the same result…

Agreed; the ads and OneDrive and such are not mistakes. They're in Windows because they make money.

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#140

As a Windows system and user-mode dev, I absolutely never understand these sorts of drive-by posts with nearly zero technical depth. If there is one thing about Windows that is really good, it is its kernel and driver architecture, and absolute plethora of user-mode libraries that come with the OS , that can be programmed against with a variety of languages from ancient to brand-new, all maintained by the vendor. Doi…

Would it be possible to ship a high performance, lean "modern" Windows, with legacy apps etc run seamlessly in VMs or containers?

Why do you need VMs or containers? Windows's architecture allows much granular control of applications, so it should be possible to limit what the applications can access to a great extent already. Unlike Linux the system ABI is stable so you can run older applications without shipping the entire userspace.

Also Windows 10 LTSC exist (not 11 with all the rounded modern UI BS). It shows how good Windows could be.

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