Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

ICE is using facial-recognition technology to quickly arrest people

wsj.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

131–140 of 213 posts

Re: ICE is using facial-recognition technology to quickly arrest people

#131

Post by amanaplanacanal »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #65
fc417fc802 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hypothetically speaking couldn't you collect it from any security camera in an area where you have positive ID on people? Airport security comes to mind. With all the trade in personal data in the US I assume it's only a matter of time before places like grocery stores start selling it. Why stop at just gait though? Geometric fingerprinting of various body parts is also possible. Palm geometry readers have been commo…

> couldn't you collect it from any security camera in an area where you have positive ID on people? Airport security comes to mind Going out on a limb and guessing illegal migrants aren’t going through airport security.

Plenty of people overstay their visa. And then we have the administration changing the rules to make people that were legal, suddenly not.

Re: ICE is using facial-recognition technology to quickly arrest people

#132

Post by amanaplanacanal »

15155 wrote: post #130
bakies wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many of these supposedly "gang banger illegal immigrants" being detained by ICE are here legally and not criminals?

I don't really care, and this isn't a valid retort. Why should some be allowed to skip the line? If they are skilled, H-1B, O-1, etc. visas should be obtainable. There's no implicit right to migrate wherever one chooses regardless of the laws of that country, sorry!

The right to travel is a basic human right, whether any particular government recognizes it or not. People have been migrating to make a better life for themselves since humans have existed. Your ancestors did it, my ancestors did it. Good luck sweeping back the tide.

Re: ICE is using facial-recognition technology to quickly arrest people

#133

Post by FpUser »

fc417fc802 wrote: post #54
FpUser wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"When China did this, this was seen as a terrible violation of rights.... Now that we do this hundreds of times a day, it has become routine." Normally questions like this would be labeled as whataboutism, false equivalence etc. One rule for thee, another one for me. Personally I think we (The West) are heading to disaster. I really missed older times before 9/11

How is pointing out this inconsistency whataboutism? It might be reasonable to ask if it's a strawman since it seems reasonable to wonder if perhaps the people against what the Chinese are doing might also be against what ICE is doing. Regardless, it's quite relevant to point out that at this point two of the world's superpowers are actively engaging in this. Claiming that the technology won't be used this way - that…

>"How is pointing out this inconsistency whataboutism? "

It is not, I said it is usually labeled as one here

Re: ICE is using facial-recognition technology to quickly arrest people

#134

Post by otterley »

bakies wrote: post #120
otterley wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From what I understand, this isn’t so much a “dragnet” operation involving combing through mass quantities of records on demand; it’s more like “this person is in public in my field of view, and I want to know who they are.” More importantly, though, the cases so far have focused on the investigative activity that follows once a suspect has been identified. Here, we’re talking about de-anonymization: identifying one…

I don't have to identify myself to police where I live. That's why, in my opinion, this is an unreasonable use of technology. I'm not sure what qualifies under the fourteenth but force-ably identifying me when I don't want to be and not required to seems unreasonable.

In the U.S., current law holds that for a law enforcement officer to stop and request identification, the officer needs at least some sort of articulable basis for doing so (Terry stop). The key word here, though, is “stop.” Electronic surveillance of a public space, though, involves stopping nobody. It’s not clear to me that passive identification involves either a “search” or “seizure” within the traditional meaning of the 4th Amendment. We’ll see what the courts think, though.

Re: ICE is using facial-recognition technology to quickly arrest people

#135

Post by nextaccountic »

_vqpz wrote: post #103
greenavocado wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This specific point is addressed in a famous 1995 anti-technology essay by Ted Kaczynski. Specifically paragraphs: 127. A technological advance that appears not to threaten freedom often turns out to threaten it very seriously later on. ... 128. While technological progress AS A WHOLE continually narrows our sphere of freedom, each new technical advance CONSIDERED BY ITSELF appears to be desirable. ... 129. Another r…

Who ever said facial recognition wasn't going to threaten freedom? None of those points feel at all relevant or substantive to the topic of discussion

Most of people have no idea and are totally ok with being tracked 24/7

Re: ICE is using facial-recognition technology to quickly arrest people

#136

Post by kingkawn »

concinds wrote: post #27
kingkawn wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In both systems the law is being carefully followed to support inhumane goals

ICE and USBP are quite famously breaking many laws.

I admit I didn’t expect this pushback against America’s corrupt current regime which is obviously morally bankrupt. But, by the letter of the law and the function of the court system they are acting with complete impunity within what they have been permitted to do to the detriment of people everywhere.

Re: ICE is using facial-recognition technology to quickly arrest people

#137

Post by SauciestGNU »

thrance wrote: post #92
mirzap wrote: post #45

We like to think surveillance is something you can turn on for one problem and turn off afterward. In practice, that never happens. Once the machinery is in place, it stays and looks for new work. Tools justified today by "illegal immigration" won’t stop there. They drift into credit scoring, health insurance pricing, hiring and firing decisions, school admissions, housing access, travel permissions, banking, welfare…

I don't think this is a useful framework for understanding these issues. What you are saying can, in essense, boil down to "any law enforcement is bad". ICE and its inhumane practices are just symptoms of an increasingly authoritarian administration that receives sufficient mandate from the population to push for increasingly authoritarian practices. The tools are just that, tools. The situation will keep getting wor…

I think we're finally seeing the culture that's been present in law enforcement forever playing out to its logical end. The solution is pretty close to "all law enforcement is bad". We're seeing that the people most prone to violence and abuse seek out positions of power in law enforcement. Basically anyone who wants to be a cop should not be allowed to be a cop.

We can blame autocrats while also blaming the complicit tools. In Grand Rapids, Michigan yesterday the local police arrested the organizer of a protest against the invasion of Venezuela while she was on camera interviewing with the local news for "obstructing a roadway" (marching in a lane with other lanes open to traffic) and "disobeying a lawful command".

When we have local beat cops colluding with national secret police and suppressing dissent, we have a very serious problem and are running out of options very quickly.

Re: ICE is using facial-recognition technology to quickly arrest people

#138

Post by bakies »

15155 wrote: post #130
bakies wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many of these supposedly "gang banger illegal immigrants" being detained by ICE are here legally and not criminals?

I don't really care, and this isn't a valid retort. Why should some be allowed to skip the line? If they are skilled, H-1B, O-1, etc. visas should be obtainable. There's no implicit right to migrate wherever one chooses regardless of the laws of that country, sorry!

Neither are any of your replies. Btw it's nearly. 70% are non-criminal and here legally. ICE's own data.

Re: ICE is using facial-recognition technology to quickly arrest people

#139

Post by pepperball »

15155 wrote: post #86
expedition32 wrote: post #79

It's not the technology. The American people voted for this. That is the real discussion you should have. Why do Americans want fascism?

> Why do Americans want fascism? Americans don't want to expend their tax dollars on folks willing to break the law for financial gain.

> Americans don't want to expend their tax dollars on folks willing to break the law for financial gain.

Then why do they keep electing the lackeys of those people into office.

The American people are idiots.

Re: ICE is using facial-recognition technology to quickly arrest people

#140

Post by bakies »

15155 wrote: post #127
bakies wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They pay into social security when they have a job just like anyone else. If it's weak social safety net then why would the immigrants choose this country for financial benefit? You're contradicting yourself right in the next bullet point. They came here for the American Dream, which is about finding a new life free from oppression against all odds. It's what this country is built on. There's nothing more patriotic t…

> They pay into social security when they have a job just like anyone else. Really? None are paid under the table? Who pays their ER bills when they break their arm while performing illegal farm labor, for instance? > If it's weak social safety net then why would the immigrants choose this country for financial benefit? You're contradicting yourself right in the next bullet point. Because it's better than from wherev…

no citizens are paid under the table?

who pays bills of citizens w/o insurance that are rushed to the emergency room?

> My ancestors weren't given free shit upon arrival

you sure about that?

We're all the same people, stop hating.

Post reply on HN