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Things I want to say to my boss

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Re: Things I want to say to my boss

#131

Post by nosianu »

strangattractor wrote: post #72
firefoxd wrote: post #30

I know this will sound a bit cynical, but I've stopped putting too much care into my employer's product. I'll deliver work and perform my best, but I'm not killing myself over it. I've built viable products where I poured my soul into it just for it to be tossed aside [0]. I've optimized processes that went from 12 hours job to 17 minutes, I was fired shortly after [1]. I even wrote on HN to get advice when I felt I…

Let's face it. Working for other people sucks. They set the agenda. They make the decisions. Often those decisions and agendas will not be what you think is best. It maybe the case that you are correct. Go start your own thing and run it how you see fit. Now if you want to see what a really "caring boss" is like watch this video of former employees of Musk. The real interesting thing is some of them seem to like the…

> Working for other people sucks.

Depends.

I worked and even had a business with and/or worked for three people that I've known for a long time. And had loud substantial disagreements with - before going into business. Worked like a charm every single time. The personal side I mean, business was neutral once, a complete failure but I only wanted the paycheck anyway once, and a resounding success in a traditional business where I handle only IT right now.

In the first venture I found out I hated selling and business. Sure, I can do it, but I really really don't want to. I am a minimalist, and I might have become a poor monk in a monastery a thousand years ago. I don't want to sell anyone anything. So in the next two businesses I left all the business stuff to others, and it is sooo much better.

And now that I'm in a non-IT traditional business I'm a servant 100%. And it is nice. My main focus is non IT stuff, and I use computers to achieve that. Finding differences in thousands of EDI messages for invoices, order confirmations and deliveries, for example. HOW - who cares? I am not developing a product. If it's a one-off I may just run some command line tools. Or, shocking!, I actually use Excel. Or I ask ChatGPT for a little helper Python script to run over the raw data files.

Doing servant work without business responsibilities is really nice :) My boss may have the bigger house and car, so what? He also has exponentially more stress (I have pretty much zero). In my youth I may have had a different opinion, but now I don't want his stress level for any amount of compensation. And no, future early retirement by making lots of money now does not change the equation. I don't want to retire at all anyway, keep doing business stuff on the side at least. Without the stress it's no problem! One of my direct colleagues is way past retirement age...

Re: Things I want to say to my boss

#132

Post by [deleted] »

eric_h wrote: post #60
the_snooze wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's toddler-level thinking. Replace the complexity of leadership, humanity, and values with "make line go up," because the latter is way easier to measure, especially when you ignore the costs that aren't yours.

Agreed. It really all is an obvious consequence of optimizing only the things that can be measured on a two dimensional graph, at the expense of all the things that can't (even though in the long term those complex, multidimensional things like culture and care and integrity do, indeed, "make line go up", though perhaps with a smaller first derivative)

[deleted]

Re: Things I want to say to my boss

#133

Post by ArcHound »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #100
ArcHound wrote: post #21

As with all issues of power abuse, the real question is: "what are you going to do about it?" If the answer from the workers is an overwhelming "nothing", then there's no reason to change. And I am not blaming workers. Bills need to be paid, mouths need to be fed. Staying low and taking it might be better than speaking up and risking homelessness. Please tell me how I am wrong, I struggle to see how the situation cou…

What are we going to do about it? Many of us are withdrawing, just putting in the time without real effort, "quiet quitting". Companies still get us, but they don't get our best. Some instead turn into... well, in the sports world, they would be called "locker room cancers". People who bring a bad attitude, and communicate it to others. Either way, companies wind up harmed by this - harmed, eventually, in terms of th…

I agree. No use in breaking yourself over a "top business priority" that'll change next week.

Maybe I'd dispute the last point - seems companies with such employees can do rather well.

Re: Things I want to say to my boss

#134

Post by dragonwriter »

nosianu wrote: post #117
dragonwriter wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is what the AI boom is really about, removing more power from labor. Its why all the AI hype largely markets itself in this way "how AI can replace or minimize X role" as opposed to "This is how you can use AI to empower your workforce in the majority of discourse I've seen around it. Arguably, AI is largely marketed that way because that's what corporate buyers care about, the same way every productivity impr…

> Arguably, AI is largely marketed that way because that's what corporate buyers care about Why "arguably", that is exactly what he wrote

No, he wrote that it was marketed that way because that is what the “AI boom is really about”, in opposition to something else, which I also discuss in the post you excerpted this from. Not sure if you didn’t read the whole post and just kneejerk reacted to the first part of the first sentence out of context, or if you just didn’t understand how it sharply differs from the claims in the post it responds to.

Re: Things I want to say to my boss

#135

Post by pdimitar »

rhyperior wrote: post #124
pdimitar wrote: post #89

To the author: You have thought about your boss likely 100x more than he ever thought about you. Don't do him this favor. You are giving him too much power that way. And be sure that he forgot about you, like COMPLETELY, maximum 72 hours after you were let go. Do the same. Take your lessons, internalize them, and forget the source. Be like an LLM: have the right conclusion inside your brain after the source material…

"I want my heart to harden." You're just at a different place in the curve of rationalizing other humans' behaviors and motivations and how they affect you. Your response is not invalid, but it makes me sad, because you think it's the best response for you. Why wouldn't you instead hold on to your empathy and make it your super power?

How exactly would empathy be a superpower? If I'm empathetic then I'm effectively making excuses for people who don't care that they make my work unbearable.

I'm very interested in your response. I have accepted that I have blind spots and I want to remove them.

Re: Things I want to say to my boss

#136

Post by rkomorn »

pdimitar wrote: post #135
rhyperior wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I want my heart to harden." You're just at a different place in the curve of rationalizing other humans' behaviors and motivations and how they affect you. Your response is not invalid, but it makes me sad, because you think it's the best response for you. Why wouldn't you instead hold on to your empathy and make it your super power?

How exactly would empathy be a superpower? If I'm empathetic then I'm effectively making excuses for people who don't care that they make my work unbearable. I'm very interested in your response. I have accepted that I have blind spots and I want to remove them.

Not "OP", but I will say that empathy can certainly help you build better things (tools, processes, policies, etc) for the people they affect.

It can also help you understand where coworkers or peers are coming from, and work with them better.

The problem comes when it's a one way road where the empathetic person is doing all the work.

Re: Things I want to say to my boss

#137

Post by wahnfrieden »

dakiol wrote: post #130
arevno wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's because many of us older developers got into the profession when it didn't pay well, and had negative status associated with it, because we loved doing it. So yes, there is very little tolerance from us toward those who are in it for money/status/prestige, and not for the love of it.

I feel divided. I do love my career (computer science/engineering) and I dedicate a lot of my free time to it (reading tech books, doing side projects, HN, etc.). But at the same time, I don't give a damn about my company. I hate the leaders, C-level execs, ... I cannot stand them, and it's not just my company, it's almost every tech company out there; so I work for the money, and take pride of my skills when working…

Fortunately there is a gold rush at the moment with consumer apps and social media marketing (methods which are called "organic" and "UGC") that is allowing many of us to escape the grind of working under ownership that doesn't care and doesn't share the value we create

Re: Things I want to say to my boss

#138

Post by lcuff »

Peter Drucker wrote that the most important thing a manager could have was 'character'. I've asked myself "What is character?", and the best answer I've come up with is: "The willingness to do the right thing regardless of negative consequences to oneself." When I look at myself, I don't believe I have character. I want to be liked too much, and in my emotional core, I'm frightened. I don't think I'm alone in this. I think a lot of people in managerial roles have little or no character, and are unwilling to take on the monster of 'the system', whatever that means in their context, because in general their superiors don't want to hear the bad news a manager with character might deliver. I've worked for managers who were complicit in hiding the dilution of stock options; who failed to push back on higher-management policies that were eroding the morale of their subordinates; who failed to be straight with subordinates about things they could improve; Who accepted ridiculous schedule demands on their teams, allowing death marches. You've probably got many examples of your own.

I wish there were some easy solution to this problem, but I don't see one. I do recommend the NASA document "What Made Apollo A Success". https://ntrs.nasa.gov/citations/19720005243

Re: Things I want to say to my boss

#139

Post by [deleted] »

pdimitar wrote: post #73
bob1029 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More people is a really difficult problem to solve in the current job market. You might think it's a buyer's market, but all you wind up hiring right now are the best liars. A lot of your honest participants have found alternative ways forward. I stopped applying to "normal" jobs a year ago. 1099 via networking and luck is my life now.

What is 1099?

[deleted]

Re: Things I want to say to my boss

#140

Post by eleveriven »

The gap between performative care and actual leadership seems to be getting wider, and companies still act shocked when turnover spikes or teams quietly disengage. What the author describes isn't some dramatic abuse, it's the slow erosion of trust
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