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The healthcare market is taxing reproduction out of existence

aaronstannard.com

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Re: The healthcare market is taxing reproduction out of existence

#131

Post by jopsen »

An American PPO with a $10 co-pay is pretty awesome. The only downside is that it's too easy to get a procedure you don't need :)

I've tried tellings doctors in Denmark I wanted X, Y, Z test and getting told, nah, the outcome wouldn't change your treatment so we don't want to order those tests.

Generally, healthcare is decent, but no doubt a good PPO plan does not compare :)

Public health care seems more like HMO, you have to use a provider within network. Sometimes you need a referral from your primary physician, etc.

You can pick your doctor, but not everyone can take on more patients.

Re: The healthcare market is taxing reproduction out of existence

#132

Post by celeritascelery »

venturecruelty wrote: post #116
mattcantstop wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have the opposite viewpoint, and I lean heavily progressive in most of my views. Healthcare in the United States isn't a market, and that is why it is so terrible. For instance, there is no reasonable ability to compare prices of services. Prices are entirely hidden. Then there is the "with insurance" price vs cash prices. Healthcare doesn't function as a market, to our detriment.

Sorry, I'm not going to Google "cheap MRIs near me" when I'm bleeding out on the floor having an emergency. Healthcare is not expensive because you can't see how much a doctor visit costs, it's expensive because that's how a lot of people make a lot of money, and they get very upset when that is threatened.

Most medical care is not an immediate emergency. If I could compare MRI prices and it would impact how much I pay (either as an insurance copay or out of pocket) I would absolutely do that. But I have no opportunity to do that so there is not price feedback like there is in a market.

Re: The healthcare market is taxing reproduction out of existence

#133

Post by AnnaPali »

godsinhisheaven wrote: post #76

A lot of this is an issue of insurance no longer being "insurance" in the classical sense. Insurance covers all sorts of things, my HSA pays for all sorts of things that I never would have even considered, and while that sounds great, it helps to drive up costs. It's somewhat counter-intuitive, but if you dropped all government funding of healthcare tomorrow, healthcare plans would get cheaper. It'd also be total cha…

Christian healthcare sharers do precisely this. By restricting services and the population addressed (your pastor or priest must sign off on your application), everything's extremely affordable. In particular, as we don't drink, do drugs, use contraceptives etc. we don't pay for coverage of them or their side effects. Obesity's also less of an issue.

There's also the trick of telling the hospital you'll pay "in cash" and getting a 10x lower bill from the hospital, then getting that reimbursed/covered by your private or alternative insurance.

Re: The healthcare market is taxing reproduction out of existence

#134

Post by Sparkle-san »

mattcantstop wrote: post #102
shermozle wrote: post #56

The first sentence is your answer. The third word even. The healthcare market. MARKET Healthcare shouldn't be a market. That's why you're paying $40k.

I have the opposite viewpoint, and I lean heavily progressive in most of my views. Healthcare in the United States isn't a market, and that is why it is so terrible. For instance, there is no reasonable ability to compare prices of services. Prices are entirely hidden. Then there is the "with insurance" price vs cash prices. Healthcare doesn't function as a market, to our detriment.

Healthcare doesn't function as a market because the nature of it is largely at odds with the principals of an efficient marketplace and perfect competition. Not to mention the tens of billions of dollars being pocketed by middlemen every year.

Re: The healthcare market is taxing reproduction out of existence

#136

Post by izacus »

swalberg wrote: post #98
hu3 wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Rational people do it at home all the time to this day. I had to read again 3 times. Are you serious? If there is any complication, you're risking 2 lives.

Father of 3 here, first two were home births, the third had complications and ended up being a hospital birth. I was initially skeptical for the same reasons but the first meeting with the midwife convinced me that they were taking every precaution and had the training to deal with whatever might come up. The majority of births are simple if you let them be and the midwives go to great lengths to make sure the condit…

Is this mindset the cause of US skyrocketing child mortality?

Re: The healthcare market is taxing reproduction out of existence

#137

Post by syntaxing »

jopsen wrote: post #131

An American PPO with a $10 co-pay is pretty awesome. The only downside is that it's too easy to get a procedure you don't need :) I've tried tellings doctors in Denmark I wanted X, Y, Z test and getting told, nah, the outcome wouldn't change your treatment so we don't want to order those tests. Generally, healthcare is decent, but no doubt a good PPO plan does not compare :) Public health care seems more like HMO, yo…

Minus the costly premium and not all employer offer PPO or its so expensive that it’s priced out as an option

Re: The healthcare market is taxing reproduction out of existence

#138

Post by Sparkle-san »

celeritascelery wrote: post #132
venturecruelty wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, I'm not going to Google "cheap MRIs near me" when I'm bleeding out on the floor having an emergency. Healthcare is not expensive because you can't see how much a doctor visit costs, it's expensive because that's how a lot of people make a lot of money, and they get very upset when that is threatened.

Most medical care is not an immediate emergency. If I could compare MRI prices and it would impact how much I pay (either as an insurance copay or out of pocket) I would absolutely do that. But I have no opportunity to do that so there is not price feedback like there is in a market.

Even if it's not an emergency, many medical events come with a lot of unknowns. Like having a baby. No way to say how long labor might be, if there will be complications, how long you'll need to stay afterwards. MRIs are actually pretty easy to shop around for and MRIs don't make up a huge part of healthcare.

Re: The healthcare market is taxing reproduction out of existence

#139

Post by venturecruelty »

celeritascelery wrote: post #132
venturecruelty wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, I'm not going to Google "cheap MRIs near me" when I'm bleeding out on the floor having an emergency. Healthcare is not expensive because you can't see how much a doctor visit costs, it's expensive because that's how a lot of people make a lot of money, and they get very upset when that is threatened.

Most medical care is not an immediate emergency. If I could compare MRI prices and it would impact how much I pay (either as an insurance copay or out of pocket) I would absolutely do that. But I have no opportunity to do that so there is not price feedback like there is in a market.

Sorry, this is simply not true. Every 1-3 years, I get a simple diagnostic procedure to make sure I don't get cancer. Without it, I'm at a very real risk of developing cancer that would quickly kill me.

There is no universe in which it doesn't cost around $10,000. None. It is simply impossible for me to get out of paying that. My options are:

1. Use insurance, and hopefully it's covered.

2. Pay out of pocket.

3. Skip it and hope I don't die.

That's it, those are my options. I can't "shop around" for this, and I shouldn't have to. This is basic medical care available to everyone in a developed nation. Ours is the only one for whom this is apparently an intractable problem, and I am, frankly, tired of being gaslit about it.

Re: The healthcare market is taxing reproduction out of existence

#140

Post by Analemma_ »

izacus wrote: post #130
toast0 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Claiming $200/month for a phone makes one wonder which numbers are valid. I'm not saying everyone needs to make a $100 phone last 5 years and use a $15/month plan, but I'm not even sure how I would get to $200/month in phone bill, even including financing an iPhone 17 Pro Max.

[flagged]

Because it indicates dishonesty and/or innumeracy which calls the accuracy of the rest of the piece into question. "Checking if the author can actually count" is basic media literary stuff, not some sinister agenda.
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