Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50? • Hacker News Board

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#131

Post by gliese1337 » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 2:41 PM UTC

edw519 wrote: post #60

57, programming for 33 years with hardly a day off, and having more fun than ever. My motivation? It's not about the technology, the tools, the apps, the business, the customers, or even the money, although any of those can provide plenty of motivation. And believe it or not, it's not even about the happy dance feeling I get when something I built works for the first time. It's about the achievements of those who use…

23, programming for, what, 14 years, maybe? And I hope I still have as much fun when I'm 57. I can certainly imagine myself doing so, for much the same reasons; it is partially about the happy dance feeling when something I built works, but long-term happiness and satisfaction come from seeing it getting used. It's really, really cool to see someone's masters thesis and think "I helped make that!" or drive by an elementary school and thing "they're using my stuff!" I may not be writing the same kinds of programs for the rest of my life, but I hope I don't ever get tired of writing useful software.

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#132

Post by mengine » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 2:42 PM UTC

jerf wrote: post #124

mengine wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This sounds pretty depressing to me. You're building the software that allows others to retire while you're a cog in someone else's wheel for another 33 years. Why not build your own achievements?

You're presuming an awful lot in that analysis there. Besides, who is not a cog in some wheel or other? In civilized countries, there is nobody who is at the top of all hierarchies, no King. It's a pejorative with no bite if it applies to all.

I just find it sad people write themselves off as never being rich or running their own business. There are 16 year olds making 6 figures writing their own iphone apps yet people view their only alternative to programming is moving to middle management.

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#133

Post by jerf » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 2:43 PM UTC

mengine wrote: post #132

jerf wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're presuming an awful lot in that analysis there. Besides, who is not a cog in some wheel or other? In civilized countries, there is nobody who is at the top of all hierarchies, no King. It's a pejorative with no bite if it applies to all.

I just find it sad people write themselves off as never being rich or running their own business. There are 16 year olds making 6 figures writing their own iphone apps yet people view their only alternative to programming is moving to middle management.

You're continuing to presume an awful lot there. I don't see edw519 saying those things.

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#134

Post by jerf » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 2:45 PM UTC

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #126

jerf wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're presuming an awful lot in that analysis there. Besides, who is not a cog in some wheel or other? In civilized countries, there is nobody who is at the top of all hierarchies, no King. It's a pejorative with no bite if it applies to all.

Pretty cynical? You can have more or less autonomy in your life, that's very important. You don't have to be King to be your own boss; you don't have to be poor to be a cog.

I am a natural cynic, yes, but people tend not to pay you unless you are doing something that makes you a cog for some period of time. It's not a criticism you can just fling at someone when you don't know their context. An experienced software contractor who is picking and choosing their own jobs is still pretty autonomous. It's more about whether you can pick where you are a cog and for whom you are a cog, than whether you are doing something that somebody can point at and screech "COG! COG!". We live in a highly interdependent society, and I think that's largely a good thing.

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#135

Post by TheFuture » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 2:47 PM UTC

Lagged2Death wrote: post #108

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #49

I love programming and still consider myself a programmer first, although I do a lot of other things too. If I wanted to rag on programming, I'd point out how many dysfunctional programming workplaces we have, or how our tools are always 100 times more complex than they need to be, or how setting up and managing the programming environment can take the joy right out of actually doing the work. (I could go on at lengt…

We're the Michelangelos of the great age of machine intelligence which is yet to come. If there's a great age of machine intelligence to come, then one in a million of us may be a Michelangelo. The rest of us are house-painters, and the houses we paint are slated for demolition within our own lifetimes.

So true. Just crushed me...

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#136

Post by lifeisstillgood » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 2:51 PM UTC

Surio wrote: post #95

lifeisstillgood wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the skillset as we get older is knowing when to duck. It might be called wisdom, mentoring, what have you but basically, having been in situation X before, you can give sensible advice to someone just entering situation X. Monetising that is generally harder

Reading through all the comments has reinforced my original comment that this kind of "bring it on" passion is heavily correlated to geo-location, culture, industry and day-to-day grind that one is put through. >> Monetising that is generally harder Tell me all about it! So, I've heard of elephant graveyards and jet graveyards... Now, where do all those grizzled, veteran (old) programmers go away (other than into man…

we hang around on HN, moaning

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#137

Post by city41 » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 2:51 PM UTC

michaelochurch wrote: post #77

I enjoy programming and would like to be doing it at 50, but with regard to the software industry itself... not in its current state. If you want to be able to survive more than 10 years in the software industry, you need to get manager-level clout and full autonomy over your work. That's non-negotiable. This industry destroys you if you don't have those things. The terrifying thing about the software industry is tha…

> If you want to be able to survive more than 10 years in the software industry, you need to get manager-level clout and full autonomy over your work. That's non-negotiable. This industry destroys you if you don't have those things.

Can you explain this further? I've been a developer for 12 years, never happier, making very nice money and constantly getting interest from other companies. Yet I have neither of those things, nor do I even want them.

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#138

Post by northband » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 2:59 PM UTC

edw519 wrote: post #60

57, programming for 33 years with hardly a day off, and having more fun than ever. My motivation? It's not about the technology, the tools, the apps, the business, the customers, or even the money, although any of those can provide plenty of motivation. And believe it or not, it's not even about the happy dance feeling I get when something I built works for the first time. It's about the achievements of those who use…

Very nice - you have meaning which is the best.

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#139

Post by drumdance » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 3:03 PM UTC

mengine wrote: post #116

edw519 wrote: post #60

57, programming for 33 years with hardly a day off, and having more fun than ever. My motivation? It's not about the technology, the tools, the apps, the business, the customers, or even the money, although any of those can provide plenty of motivation. And believe it or not, it's not even about the happy dance feeling I get when something I built works for the first time. It's about the achievements of those who use…

This sounds pretty depressing to me. You're building the software that allows others to retire while you're a cog in someone else's wheel for another 33 years. Why not build your own achievements?

THis seems really short sighted. I consider IBM's Watson a great achievement, but the people who built it are all technically cogs in IBM's machine.

Achievement is what you feel inside. A large bank account is nice validation of a certain class of achievements, but not the only kind.

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#140

Post by nydev » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 3:07 PM UTC

I will still enjoy programming at 50 and will still want to it for money. But will the ageism in this industry permit that to happen? It feels like the tech culture must change to accept that there are good programmers who aren't in their 20s.