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Game design is simple

raphkoster.com

131–140 of 186 posts

Re: Game design is simple

#131
post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you look at most games, they're all repeated challenges, but some are so good that you don't see or experience them as such. Others are very obvious though; MMORPGs are the obvious answer and they often don't even have an interesting story or reward to go with the grind, because the reward is a gamble. Ubisoft games are another example, ever since the first Assassin's Creed their games have generally been the same…

Some pushback to this: I understand MMORPGS are addictive, but for some reason I was never hooked, so their "repetitive" aspect is a negative to me. For Assassin's Creed, it was so repetitive even within the same game (the first one) I couldn't even finish it once I noticed the grind. It drove me nuts. A lot of games then followed that pattern (e.g. Shadow of Mordor, Mad Max, and I'm sure countless others -- I just m…

Variety is very important.

In the case of the first Assassin’s Creed, I’d argue that the “toy” (running around, climbing buildings, challenging yourself to seamless parkour runs, stabbing guards etc.) is a lot of fun, but to progress the game forces you to do those fun things in a series of very rigid, repetitive, arbitrary challenges that can be difficult without adding anything new, and which block the story progression behind a checklist.

Papers Please has simple mechanics, but makes the player balance a lot of different factors while offering a steady stream of surprises and new situations to consider.

There’s an element of personal preference too, of course.

Re: Game design is simple

#132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is not getting better at learning. That’s repeatedly re-learning in the same way.

Ahh, sorry we’re talking past one another then because I hadn’t twigged you were talking about getting better at learning because that’s not what I meant with my initial post! Although I can see why you took that from it. I do like that meta observation though that not only do people get better at prediction through learning they can also get better at the rate at which they improve their predictions.

It’s careless of me to say it’s a definition of intelligence, but I do think that property of being able to improve how you learn and how quickly you learn (especially in response to adversaries doing the same thing) is a clear indicator of intelligence and there’s a good argument that that’s why we developed intelligence. These aren’t my ideas either, I’m just parroting what I recently read in the book “What is Intelligence” by Blaise Aguera y Arcas.

Re: Game design is simple

#133
post #17
post #4

For reference Raph Koster wrote "the book" on game design, and was the lead designer for Ultima Online (among other things) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raph_Koster

Raph was the lead game designer on SWTOR a game that was way ahead of it's time and one of the most enjoyable sandbox mmorpg's I've ever played. I'm working on a new game that will take inspiration from lessons learned there.

> Raph was the lead game designer on SWTOR a game that was way ahead of it's time

I think you meant Star Wars Galaxies, which was definitely ahead of its time and few MMORPGS have replicated its sandbox MMORPG since.

Re: Game design is simple

#134
post #81
post #15

This reads like the handbook for people making grind-based games. Sure enough, the author exclusively works in the mmorpg space. If you are a game designer, please take this with a grain of salt. Fun does not equal repeated challenges. And let me also reject the implicit notion that stories are entertainment but not, academically speaking, fun.

Personally what I find off-putting is throwing around the term "dopamine". Yeah, there's a link and all, but why include this bit? > Dopamine can release for 'richly interpretable' situations Ok, and? I mean, Oh, right. The dopamine. The dopamine for gamers, the dopamine chosen especially to entertain gamers, gamers' dopamine. That dopamine?

not to mention that dopamine is generally associated with anticipation and searching + reinforcing behaviours, whereas pleasure and satisfaction is associated with the opiate system

Re: Game design is simple

#136
post #108
post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn’t say A Theory of Fun is “the book.” It’s more a coffee table read. “The book” is Jesse Schell’s The Art of Game Design

I've come across this kind of comment elsewhere, and the recommendation was that "the book" is Designing Games by Tynan Sylvester (the author of Rimworld) https://tynansylvester.com/book/ Haven't read it yet myself.

Tynan's book is popular, but in my limited experience the first book most people recommend for anyone looking into design is Book of Lenses. Mind you I think both are worth reading. Lenses is just a more systemic and deeper dive.

Re: Game design is simple

#137

My question: is there a concise theory of game design that properly explains why cutscenes are fucking stupid ? There are a lot of AAA games out there that very clearly seem like the developers wish they were directing a movie instead. Sure, there’s loads of cutscenes to show off some cool visuals. But then they seem to think “ok well we need to actually let the player play now”, but it’s still basically a cutscene,…

Cutscenes add to the sense of immersion playing the game. I like them, but I also like to skip them if I've already played the game before.

Re: Game design is simple

#138
post #43

My question: is there a concise theory of game design that properly explains why cutscenes are fucking stupid ? There are a lot of AAA games out there that very clearly seem like the developers wish they were directing a movie instead. Sure, there’s loads of cutscenes to show off some cool visuals. But then they seem to think “ok well we need to actually let the player play now”, but it’s still basically a cutscene,…

> But I digress… I essentially hate games nowadays This is not exactly a new phenomenon. The final cutscene in Metal Gear Solid 4 (2008) is 71 minutes long (Guinness world record). The total cutscenes add up to around 9 hours according to a Reddit user. Maybe more games are doing this now compared to 15 years ago, but I wouldn't bet on it.

[dead]

Re: Game design is simple

#140

Tell me why all MMOs are crap or just fail and as a result turned into a gambling institution.

I thought this was obvious? These are social games where everyone is in the same funnel and the players with the most time dominate others... but also need new objectives. At the beginning you quest with people your level, but they always, always devolve into bigger, more tedious tasks (raids) that have less and less differentiated rewards (1% chance of a drop that boosts you 2%) because otherwise you have players at level 283 and there is no way to balance team dynamics as some people scale infinitely.
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