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Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

businessinsider.com

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Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#131

Post by scarface_74 »

neilv wrote: post #117
sharts wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While sketchy and total crap move on MS. What recourse do employees really have? MS likely consulted with their army of lawyers before pulling this. Actions might be crappy but not illegal. Not a lawyer but employers are usually allowed to dictate the terms of the employment agreements and requiring someone to go into an office to work can be one of them. Even changing from permanent remote to onsite at a later time…

To non-lawyer me, this sounds like something for which lawyers have a term: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constructive_dismissal If I've heard of this angle, I assume that lawyers know many angles that may apply.

And?

As long as it isn’t discriminatory, since 49 of the 50 states are at will employment, you can be let go at anytime for any reason or no reason.

It might come into play with unemployment insurance but the weekly amount is so low it’s laughable.

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#132

Post by geodel »

christhecaribou wrote: post #34
SilverElfin wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think they’re realizing that there is no meaningful competition for these gigantic corporations. They’re worth 4 trillion. They saw Google got away without any consequence on the Chrome anti trust issue. They know they can keep bundling products, building new dark patterns, throwing up walled gardens, loss leading competitors (like Teams did with Slack), and all of that. And I’m sure Satya is currying favor with Tr…

It just makes me sick growing up in the USA, hearing about the beauty of “competition”, and then growing up to see that not only does it not exist… they cannot even be bothered to pretend.

> It just makes me sick growing up in the USA,

As always when feeling terrible check out other places to if and where better things exist.

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#133

Post by geodel »

OptionOfT wrote: post #98

50 miles is a lot. That can easily be 2h in most big cities. To do what exactly? Sit in an open office in Redmond, jump on Teams to call with someone in Fort Lauderdale? Funny thing, I had multiple interviews with them on explicit remote roles (which are different from roles that went remote during COVID). I wonder if the policy changes there.

> To do what exactly?

To stay employed at Microsoft. After all many may want that some may not.

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#134

Post by geodel »

UltraSane wrote: post #59
ortusdux wrote: post #8

Don't have to announce layoffs if you can make a few percent quit.

This also filters for subservience.

Yeah, nowadays missing those brave hearts who would turn post lunch walks in to protest walks whenever they saw injustice in the world.

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#135

Post by lobf »

SilverElfin wrote: post #116
lobf wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know the stats and they're absolutely damning. https://injuryfacts.nsc.org/home-and-community/safety-topics... You're orders of magnitude more likely to die in a car vs on a bus.

Deaths are one problem, but they may also not be distributed evenly. Some cities or states have more issues on public transit than others. But also you can still be a victim of assault, harassment, theft, and other issues on public transit. Many of these issues also go unreported or don’t get counted in official stats if not accompanied by a formal police report or whatever. So it doesn’t tell the full story of what…

>Some cities or states have more issues on public transit than others.

Sure, but that doesn't change the stats.

>But also you can still be a victim of assault, harassment, theft, and other issues on public transit.

As can you in a car.

>Many of these issues also go unreported or don’t get counted in official stats if not accompanied by a formal police report or whatever.

They use estimates for unreported crimes. I trust the institution to provide the best possible data.

>So it doesn’t tell the full story of what people’s real experiences are.

Do you think there's any chance in hell that actual deaths / injuries on public transport even begin to approach those in cars?

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#136

Post by at-fates-hands »

adamiscool8 wrote: post #128

>We’ve looked at how our teams work best, and the data is clear: when people work together in person more often, they thrive — they are more energized, empowered, and they deliver stronger results. Citation needed or this is just more vibe-xecutive decree.

Anecdotal evidence to counter this argument.

Work at a fortune 200 company. We spent COVID all 100% remote WFH. After several quarters of their entire workforce working remotely, they were gushing about how productivity increased, satisfaction scores went through the roof and the company recorded several record breaking quarters in revenue during a time they expected the exact opposite to happen.

This inevitably lead them to having one helluva hard time trying to get people back into the office since they owned about a dozen buildings where the majority of their employees were supposed to be working. After a year and several attempts, they instead sold most of their real estate holdings and have since consolidated everybody into just a few buildings. The new rule is that if you are less than 30 mins from the office, you need to come in at least twice a week. Not a huge hurdle and so far, has been met with little if any resistance.

I have to give them credit. They tried ordering people back in, and ultimately pivoted and sold their real estate instead.

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#137

Post by trenchpilgrim »

Philadelphia wrote: post #122
tokai wrote: post #66

Commute time should be salaried time. Then the whole office/home work discussion could be taken with the true costs involved.

And workers should be paid to have space to work from home and internet service and food and office supplies and electricity.

I'm a remote worker and I get an annual stipend to equip my home office and reinbursement for my internet and cell phone.

The stipend is flexible. Some of my coworkers stocked their home office with snacks, for example.

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#138

Post by nomel »

adamiscool8 wrote: post #128

>We’ve looked at how our teams work best, and the data is clear: when people work together in person more often, they thrive — they are more energized, empowered, and they deliver stronger results. Citation needed or this is just more vibe-xecutive decree.

Corporate analysts were "gifted" with a two impossibly rare step functions, that will probably never be repeated in our lifetimes: Near 100% -> near 0% percent in office, then 0% percent -> partial% in office. With most (all?) of the big companies following the same path, I think it's safe to assume the data points to the same conclusion: in whole, humans work better together.

It makes you wonder if it's a fundamental part of our evolution, or something. ;)

It would be very interesting to see their rational.

Re: Microsoft is officially sending employees back to the office

#139

Post by Mobius01 »

I work in a large company that mandated 4-day RTO last year. Even taking a completely objetive point of view on the situation leads to the conclusion that something else is needed. We spend our days at our desks, on Zoom calls. People won’t get up to join in person - mostly because the conference rooms are all blocked by “special projects”, but mostly due to the offshoring of positions and distributed workforce post-pandemic. We are all spending valuable time on commutes to do what was possible from home.

Now I suspect the C-suite has noticed the discrepancy between attendance and occupancy, and I fully expect that their solution in this job market to be a 5-days, monitored attendance RTO soon. We are regressing at an alarming rate.

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