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Age verification doesn’t work

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Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#131

Post by ghssds »

lordhumphrey wrote: post #64
nomilk wrote: post #6

The choice citizens have now is between an 'internet licence' (submit ID's to myriad sites), or an 'internet tax' (VPN). Super annoying! Given Australia doesn't even require Age Verification on porn sites (only on social media sites), the incentives hint this was strongly supported by legacy media (90% of Aussie media is owned by two companies, Newscorp and Nine Entertainment). The internet licence will make it diffi…

The 'internet tax' will not last, either, I fear. Loads of VPNs are simply, someone other than the local ISP gets your data. Mullvad seems trustworthy, as an exception to this, and who else? And even then, Mullvad faces issues from websites and censorious countries trying to block it and bother its users all the time.

What about a VPS and ssh -D ?

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#132

Post by triceratops »

mos_basik wrote: post #128
dragonwriter wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I haven't heard a good explanation for why my proposal is bad other than it's not perfect. It has the same flaw as the common age verification laws: it is unnecessarily intrusive; but I wasn’t, in the grandparent post, commenting on the merits, I was commenting on your description of the proposal as being both very different from what is currently being proposed and “just like buying alcohol or tobacco”, since it i…

>it is nothing like buying alcohol and tobacco The intent of the "I don't crack open a beer.." post was to draw a comparison between "show ID at physical store then later open and drink the beer at home" and "show ID at physical store then later submit the token and watch the porn at home". >and shares the basic features which are different and more intrusive How so? Are you maybe assuming that some entity (the ID is…

There's no reason for each site to roll their own card provider or for there to be a central authority. There could easily be 5 or 7 companies providing this product and sites could choose to accept any or all of them.

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#133

Post by triceratops »

dragonwriter wrote: post #117
triceratops wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't crack open the beer in front of the cashier either. That's even illegal in many jurisdictions. I go home and drink it in private, or sometimes with friends. They have literally no way to know if I give it to a minor. But that's considered good enough age verification for a substance that can be lethal if consumed to excess or before driving (which teenagers are allowed to do). I haven't heard a good explanati…

> I haven't heard a good explanation for why my proposal is bad other than it's not perfect. It has the same flaw as the common age verification laws: it is unnecessarily intrusive; but I wasn’t, in the grandparent post, commenting on the merits, I was commenting on your description of the proposal as being both very different from what is currently being proposed and “just like buying alcohol or tobacco”, since it i…

If you pay in cash, wear a mask, and buy your token scratch card a couple counties or states over it's as close to anonymous age verification as possible.

Admittedly it's still more intrusive than the status quo (what if the cashier has a photographic memory? what if the store's surveillance cams zoom in on your ID as you hand it over?). But several orders of magnitude less intrusive and scary than uploading your driver's license to random websites to read some forum posts.

Everyone seems to be going toward the latter age verification methods right now. Assuming there's no stopping this age verification train, we can try to limit the damage.

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#134

Post by triceratops »

prmoustache wrote: post #67
edu wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it will be harder for them, the same way it's harder to get alcohol if you don't have a proper ID, and just that will prevent a good number of them of accessing it or at least accessing it in a regular way.

Well in the case of alcohol and tobacco it is a bit different, it is a physical good that can't be cloned infinitely and distributed through many medias. If you don't want your kids to have access to the internet at home and fap all afternoon it is quite easy. If you don't want them to look at smartphone from other kids, all bets are off. As an under 12y old, my first encounter with porn was as porn paper magazines r…

> it is a physical good that can't be cloned infinitely and distributed through many medias

And age verification can't stop that no matter what. It's solely for restricting access to websites and apps.

> No amount of server side age verification will prevent kids and teenagers from sharing stuff.

Great, now convince the politicians and the voting public of that. See how things are going. It would be better to have some system in place that protects adults' privacy and restricts some underage access. Instead of having to upload your passport to every website 5 years from now.

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#135

Post by amradio1989 »

An adult content provider is legally bound to not distribute to minors. Its not even debatable.

Your local adult video store can't sell to minors. They have to check id. If they don't, and a minor buys some goods, the store is liable.

Your local strip club can't let minors into their doors. They have to check id. If they don't, and a minor gains entry, the club is liable.

The same applies to all age-restricted products everywhere, online or offline. I can't buy liquor on doordash without showing ID for crying out loud.

But for some (probably nefarious) reason, online adult content providers want to pretend the rule doesn't apply to them. Device-level controls? Hilarious. What... are we going to add device-controls to a teenager's car to prevent them from driving to liquor stores too?

Don't get me wrong, there's some shady stuff behind AV. But I strongly disagree with the notion that an adult content provider isn't responsible for restricting their content in a way that works.

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#136

Post by amradio1989 »

BriggyDwiggs42 wrote: post #127
lp0_on_fire wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bars and Casinos argued the exact same thing when we mandated they check the IDs of a patron before serving them a drink. The world didn't stop spinning.

But the law applied to almost all bars because it’s more enforceable. I don’t mean to white knight for the porn company but I think it’s a good point.

It's not really a good point. Yes it's more difficult, but that doesn't exempt them from complying. And they've made basically zero effort to comply.

You could argue quite convincingly that the explosion of adult content sites is due largely to evading regulation and reaching a wider (ie: illegal) audience.

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#137

Post by ipaddr »

lp0_on_fire wrote: post #121
ipaddr wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. Sending your government issued id to random porn sites is asking for your identity to be stolen. Sites filter out any child porn because those are different serious laws. I can live with revenge porn because it's really amateur porn labelled another way. Like supporting eco friendly porn where you walk to the hotel instead of drive. Regulating markets where someone unvested group of people decide the rules on wh…

> I can live with revenge porn because it's really amateur porn labelled another way. "revenge porn", by definition is non-consensual. You might as well have said "I can live with rape because it's just love labeled another way".

That's disrespectful to anyone who has been raped. Someone posting a private video of a consensual action is not rape in any way shape or form. That's a warped viewpoint that needs to be changed. I recommend you speak with a rape survivor.

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#138

Post by ipaddr »

delusional wrote: post #118
ipaddr wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. Sending your government issued id to random porn sites is asking for your identity to be stolen. Sites filter out any child porn because those are different serious laws. I can live with revenge porn because it's really amateur porn labelled another way. Like supporting eco friendly porn where you walk to the hotel instead of drive. Regulating markets where someone unvested group of people decide the rules on wh…

> Yes. Sending your government issued id to random porn sites is asking for your identity to be stolen. Ah, so you don't understand what's being proposed. Let me clear that up. The implementation proposed by the EU does not involve your government issued id, but rather an openid style handoff to a trusted government entity, where you verify your identity with your government, followed by a handback along with a proof…

A lot of disgusting legal porn exists. Revenge porn is just boring amateur porn that doesn't have consent attached. Both parties may or may not have knowledge of it and someone decides to share after the relationship ends. It's part of their relationship, its a real event that shows a moment of closeness and its an expression of real love. It doesn't interest me but to find you think its so disgusting sounds fake. People have real lives and real relationships that are raw and doesn't always show you in the light you want to present but if its honest and real its life. It's art in a different form.

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#140

Post by jheriko »

amradio1989 wrote: post #135

An adult content provider is legally bound to not distribute to minors. Its not even debatable. Your local adult video store can't sell to minors. They have to check id. If they don't, and a minor buys some goods, the store is liable. Your local strip club can't let minors into their doors. They have to check id. If they don't, and a minor gains entry, the club is liable. The same applies to all age-restricted produc…

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