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Ozempic shows anti-aging effects in trial

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Re: Ozempic shows anti-aging effects in trial

#131

Post by frumper »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #93
noah_buddy wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people (will only speak to America), view being fat as a literal moral failing. Gluttony or overeating are not the sin, but being fat. (From that perspective:)a miracle cure that allows someone to stop being fat is like an indulgence (in the Roman Catholic sense). It’s a cheat, a shortcut that allows the unworthy to reach a state they do not deserve. My opinion is to wait long enough to validate there are no lon…

> Gluttony or overeating are not the sin, but being fat. This is a strange thing to say. If you do something normal, and you end up in a normal state, why would that be a moral failing? There's no such thing as "overeating". Different people eat different amounts. The same person eats different amounts at different times. > (From that perspective:)a miracle cure that allows someone to stop being fat is like an indulg…

Everyone defines normal differently and people are quite good at judging those that are not their normal.

Re: Ozempic shows anti-aging effects in trial

#132

Post by nxobject »

Aurornis wrote: post #111
noah_buddy wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people (will only speak to America), view being fat as a literal moral failing. Gluttony or overeating are not the sin, but being fat. (From that perspective:)a miracle cure that allows someone to stop being fat is like an indulgence (in the Roman Catholic sense). It’s a cheat, a shortcut that allows the unworthy to reach a state they do not deserve. My opinion is to wait long enough to validate there are no lon…

> Many people (will only speak to America), view being fat as a literal moral failing. Gluttony or overeating are not the sin, but being fat. I feel like I've seen and heard more of the opposite: The trend is to avoiding anything that might make someone feel blame for arriving in their situation. With obesity the trend is to blame some combination of "our food supply", trending science topics like microplastics or th…

> I feel like I've seen and heard more of the opposite: The trend is to avoiding anything that might make someone feel blame for arriving in their situation.

> I've heard countless people explain to me that dieting doesn't work for them.

I think you're being a tad reductive – "dieting right now doesn't work for me for reasons I can't control" and "reducing calorie intake will help me reduce weight" aren't necessary contradictory, and don't imply "I'm going to attribute it all to biology/blame it on something general".

Anyway, let me assert the opposite: as a partner of a nutritionist who's talked (with anonymity) about her clients, the majority of the people she's worked with, who struggle with sustainably reducing calorie intake over the course of years, come to dieting with that logic, and _then_ struggle against specific barriers, and _then_ blame themselves. (A recent example: "because of my work schedule I don't get enough sleep, which leads to weight gain and time only for frozen food – on top of my predispositions".)

In that case, GLP-1 inhibitors as an intervention _complements_ the way her clients think about dieting.

Re: Ozempic shows anti-aging effects in trial

#133

Post by kulahan »

cjbgkagh wrote: post #97
kulahan wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Semaglutide is a signaling peptide, these are basically in a different class of medication that has traditionally been largely ignored. Partly due to difficulty defending patents for a class of medication that the body produces naturally, I.e. the instructions are in the DNA. Even if a drug company patents one GLP-1A they can’t patent all of them and any of them will work much the same way. Because it’s a naturally o…

We didn't even know what "junk DNA" did until like 25 years ago. We've discovered a couple new body parts in the last 50 years. We don't have any real understanding of how basic, foundational parts of medicine work - things like anesthesia and antidepressants and even pain differences between men and women. Tests are regularly performed on highly homogenous groups, or even tested on groups completely different from the target audience. The US allows us to advertise medicines on TV, and this gets people thinking they have some vague understanding of medicine - which they do not. I mean, maybe the unreasonably smart audience of this site may, but for the extreme majority of Americans, they do not.

I think our massive advancement in the computer industry has confused people into thinking other industries which use computers are also advanced, but this is not the case. Pharmacology is an extremely immature field.

Edit: I think the only field more immature than this would be psychology? And I don't think many are silly enough to trust a field who still worships a dude that believed every thought you had was somehow actually about sex, and has made zero advancements beyond borrowing meditation and a few other ideas from other cultures.

Re: Ozempic shows anti-aging effects in trial

#134

Post by trhway »

noah_buddy wrote: post #20
some_random wrote: post #15

I find it fascinating how much a pretty large group of people just hate semaglutides and seemingly need to believe that it's some kind of Faustian bargain. I'm not talking about the people who are cautious or suspicious, that's more than reasonable, but it's clear that it's not cautious optimism in many.

Many people (will only speak to America), view being fat as a literal moral failing. Gluttony or overeating are not the sin, but being fat. (From that perspective:)a miracle cure that allows someone to stop being fat is like an indulgence (in the Roman Catholic sense). It’s a cheat, a shortcut that allows the unworthy to reach a state they do not deserve. My opinion is to wait long enough to validate there are no lon…

>My opinion is to wait long enough to validate there are no long term harms, but beyond that, yeah, adjust the priors, it could be a modern aspirin.

it can be more than aspirin. Such an effect on glucose should, among other things, be affecting cancer, probably in a very positive way.

Re: Ozempic shows anti-aging effects in trial

#135

Post by mullingitover »

matwood wrote: post #68
jjice wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was kind of scared of these when Ozempic starting picking of steam for weight loss. I was worried that this would be having more negative effects. Turns out, generally speaking, if used with you doctor, these things are pretty safe, especially comparatively to some of the negatives of being overweight. And then I saw some of the stories on HN about how it's changed peoples lives for the better. And then people in m…

And not just weight loss, but the people I know on GLP-1's have also significantly cut back on alcohol. I think there are ongoing trials around GLP-1's and general addiction.

The cynic in my thinks this will its undoing. Some huge fraction of alcohol profits come from a small portion of drinkers. If these G* peptides help these poor people their drinking under control, it would take a huge wrecking ball to the profits, and thus to the taxes. Can't have that.

Re: Ozempic shows anti-aging effects in trial

#136

Post by throw-qqqqq »

jorts wrote: post #47
neves wrote: post #43

Be very cautious with these miracle drug headlines. There's a strong financial incentive to highlight only the good news. My mother, a healthy and active 87-year-old, started taking Ozempic because she was overweight and her doctor was impressed by the drug’s supposed miracles. She ended up suffering from severe intestinal motility issues, went through a lot of pain, and had to be admitted to the ICU. The long-term s…

Haven’t these types of drugs been in use for ~15 years?

> Haven’t these types of drugs been in use for ~15 years?

The predecessor of semaglutide, liraglutide has been sold since 1998. GLP-1 has been studied since the 70s. The first human was injected with GLP-1 agonists in 1993 IIRC.

Re: Ozempic shows anti-aging effects in trial

#137

Post by kulahan »

leidenfrost wrote: post #126
kulahan wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think many people confuse simple with easy. It IS simple to reduce your weight. There are like, two things you need to do. It is, however, VERY hard to actually do those things.

But it's not. What you're referring to, is the basic concept of thermodynamic calorie in/calorie out. Yes, you can "just" reduce food and lose weight if you hit deficit numbers. But if you don't do it correctly, you'll feel like trash, you'll suffer bad cravings, and put yourself in a stressful mental situation for days, possibly putting your job at risk. You have to: - Eat less than what you're already eating - But…

Right, so exactly like I said, it's very simple. If you want to lose weight, reduce calories.

If you add extra modifiers like "I want to feel great while doing it" and "I want to lose weight while sedentary" and "I want to continue eating whatever stupid thing I want" and "I need to be able to scroll tiktok for at least 3 hours, leaving no time for cooking", it gets much more complicated.

Side note: LOL at "but if you're craving food you might get fired!!1!" - this is professional victimhood at its finest.

Re: Ozempic shows anti-aging effects in trial

#138

Post by mapontosevenths »

n8cpdx wrote: post #83
alistairSH wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've read (anecdotes from people in the fitness/body-building space) that the default dosing could be too high for many people. And the side-effects seem to ramp up with the dose. IE, if you're getting weight loss at 1/2 the default dose, you might want to stay there, even if your MD wants you to increase to the default. [default uses loosely here - people build up from a low dose over the span of weeks/months] And t…

I tried it. I started down about 80 lbs from my heaviest, but a good 40 lbs from ideal/20 lb from healthy weight. The first time I tried it I followed dosing guidelines for ramp up; side effects were horrible, didn’t lose much weight, and it just kept getting worse. Second time, after a few months off, I started at lowest dose and stayed there. Side effects were better to start but ramped up again. Eventually my dige…

Try Zepbound. You lose more weight with far fewer side effects.

Although, you may still have issues. It does just sound like there's something unique about your chemistry. I don't think that many of those side effects are even in the ballpark of normal.

Re: Ozempic shows anti-aging effects in trial

#139

Post by jjice »

matwood wrote: post #68
jjice wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was kind of scared of these when Ozempic starting picking of steam for weight loss. I was worried that this would be having more negative effects. Turns out, generally speaking, if used with you doctor, these things are pretty safe, especially comparatively to some of the negatives of being overweight. And then I saw some of the stories on HN about how it's changed peoples lives for the better. And then people in m…

And not just weight loss, but the people I know on GLP-1's have also significantly cut back on alcohol. I think there are ongoing trials around GLP-1's and general addiction.

I've heard similar for gambling, and as one of the sister comments said, things like video games. I'm so curious to understand _why_ that effect is there, but I've heard this so many times now that I do believe that it exists in some capacity. Such an interesting world we're opening up here.

Re: Ozempic shows anti-aging effects in trial

#140

Post by mapontosevenths »

smiley1437 wrote: post #65
hollerith wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not even ready to concede that it is a good weight-loss drug -- but then I haven't really investigated much, so I'm just repeating what I heard from researcher Ben Bikman and maybe other researchers. I heard that most people choose to discontinue it after 4 or 5 years or less, regain most or all of the weight, then refuse to go back on it.

Tirzepatide (and likely other GLPs) have limitations that are rarely brought up in the general media - Patients have about 72 weeks to reach maximum loss, they don't lose any more weight after 72 weeks even on the highest dose. - Patients appear to immediately gain the weight back as soon as they stop taking it. It's right in the phase 3 trial outcomes paper: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10667099/ I suspe…

I'm fairly certain that literally every doctor tells literally every patient this. Mine sure did. It's also on the handout your pharmacy gives you, the website for the drug, and in fine print at the bottom of most commercials.

Nobody expects a single does of ibuprofen to cure your headaches for life. Similarly, this doesn't "fix" your biochemistry for life, you have to take it in order for it to work.

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