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AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

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Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a lot more to the American defensive posture in the Pacific than threatening PRC with MAD if they invade Taiwan.

American defensive posture can center around Hawaii and mainland USA will be just fine.

Sure if we just compelety ignore our treaty partners in Japan, Philipines, India, Korea and US territories in Guam, Samoa, Marianas... or bases like Diego Garcia.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#132

If they were worth it you'd already have been buying them. With that being said, glad to hear a CEO say "we have to consider the resiliency of the supply chain" because JIT as a manufacturing philosophy is revealing itself to be what it always was: exceedingly fragile, barely adequate when everything is working perfectly and subject to massive, multiplicative disruptions when everything is not working perfectly.

Funny, it's not that different to programming in Node or browsers. The JIT is awesome, but theres so many stories of fragile performance pits.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#133

If they were worth it you'd already have been buying them. With that being said, glad to hear a CEO say "we have to consider the resiliency of the supply chain" because JIT as a manufacturing philosophy is revealing itself to be what it always was: exceedingly fragile, barely adequate when everything is working perfectly and subject to massive, multiplicative disruptions when everything is not working perfectly.

Funny, it's not that different to programming in Node or browsers. The JIT is awesome, but theres so many stories of fragile performance pits.

the concept is the same: do you do work in advance and bear the cost of storing it and maybe not using it, or do you do work as-needed and hope that the additional cost of trying to deliver immediately is less than the cost of storage and overrun? the answer seems to be the same, too, "depends on whether you have resources to spare and whether the environment is stable enough to count on immediate delivery"

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#134
post #37

So are they going to try and spread this extra cost to customers worldwide? I'm fine with chips made in Taiwan.

Yeah this reads like an attempt to push the "made in America" narrative the admin wants. "Things will cost more but it's made in the US" And this is good because...why? It's not about broadening the supply chain to the consumers benefit. It's about avoiding the disaserous tariff strategy which the company isn't even paying in the first place.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ISA is irrelevant It's like saying that programming language syntax/keywords are better than the other. Everything is about compiler, lib, runtime, etc. https://chipsandcheese.com/p/arm-or-x86-isa-doesnt-matter Also some people say that RISC-V is the way to go

And yet Itanium flopped.

By all accounts I can find Itanium performance was good, perhaps even great when writing assembly. It seems to reinforce the point that ISA doesn't really matter.

But let's be clear: Of course ISA matters. It's just as trivial to make a bad ISA as it is a bad syntax. But does the ISA of modern superscalar processors matter? Probably a bit, but certainly not a whole lot.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#136
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Intel is more than just fabs. AMD spun off digital foundry forever ago and just uses TSMC, no reason Intel couldn’t do the same. At this point their fabs are a liability. They have a new leader who’s from a semiconductor manufacturing background so I have some faith they’ll give up on the pursuit of next gen fabs and focus instead on their IP. There’s a huge opportunity in their GPU segment. They’ve gone from a joke…

Owning fabs is the only thing that makes Intel special IMO. There are dozens if not hundreds of fabless semiconductor companies. If everyone chases higher margin and ditches their fabs what kind of industry are we left with? One giant fab company like TSMC? That sounds healthy!

>There are dozens if not hundreds of fabless semiconductor companies.

How many of them develop high performance x64-64 cores?

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#137
post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tariffs don't work to bring manufacturing back home if they change every 2 weeks and are sure to disappear in 4 years You need to have reasonable certainty that your factory is going to be profitable on a 20+ year horizon to commit into building a production line. I don't understand how MAGAs don't get that.

When Biden came into office, he kept MOST of Trump's tariffs on China and even added a bunch of his own. Despite the marketing, the tariffs are fairly bi-partisan among the congress.

The ones on Chinese EVs to protect the local car industry maybe, the blanket 10% he puts on your allies and the 25% if the allies are too woke maybe not.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

American defensive posture can center around Hawaii and mainland USA will be just fine.

Sure if we just compelety ignore our treaty partners in Japan, Philipines, India, Korea and US territories in Guam, Samoa, Marianas... or bases like Diego Garcia.

That certainly doesn't sound as unlikely as it once did...

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#139
post #34

What I really want to know, from someone who does know: Is Intel cooked? Like, will they be able to manufacture chips that compete with TSMC? They used to be a crown-jewel of US tech. But it seems like every time I read the news, they are announcing a delay or shutting down some product.

I'm not into hardware but I remember when AMD was sneered at, and all real CPUs were Intel. Then Ryzen happened. My meta conclusion is that its super hard to tell when someone is done, and it can change quickly. Or not. Sometimes it if looks like terminal decline, it simply is terminal decline.

That has happened like 4 times with AMD already since I've been buying PCs

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#140
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These plants have nothing to do with tariffs though? They were in development prior to any tariffs and were partially funded by the CHIPS act. If anything, that’s the opposite of tariffs…

My point is, the cost of goods being produced in the US is not dramatically higher, as outlined in the article. Even very basic tariffs would level the playing field and bring economic benefits domestically, without a major impact to the consumer.

That assumes you have the means to bring the production domestically first.

This is a confluence of the previous administration having the forethought to do this, before the current administration tried to kill the CHIPS act.

If they hadn’t done that, you likely wouldn’t have seen domestic production able to satisfy the needs.

Tariffs alone are a misguided cudgel.

Also your comment about a “major impact to the consumer” ignores that this is an increase in cost just for the silicon. There’s a lot of tariffs on different parts of the actual product.

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