Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Cloudflare CEO: Football piracy blocks will claim lives

torrentfreak.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

131–140 of 283 posts

Re: Cloudflare CEO: Football piracy blocks will claim lives

#131

Post by michaelt »

AlotOfReading wrote: post #110
michaelt wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Cloudflare goes public in frustration, noting that they could just send take down requests for infringing content like every other rights holder in the world, Live sports piracy has the unusual property that you have to be able to get the block in place within the ~90 minutes of a football match, even at weekends and across time zones. Otherwise there’s no point. If the courts let Cloudflare slow roll this, at the…

How are streaming sites registering new domains and getting the site info out to the audience in that time frame? I suspect they're not and there's actually a period there's a window of weeks or longer for enforcement actions to be taken.

Users visit aggregator sites which don’t host the streams, they just link to them.

Then the streams are on sites with names like fins38gy2m.ws a new URL for every game.

The hosts of the streams can set up an URL days in advance, and post it to the aggregators at the start of the game.

Re: Cloudflare CEO: Football piracy blocks will claim lives

#132

Post by refulgentis »

budududuroiu wrote: post #11
refulgentis wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's bad to steal things and we should try to prevent it. (I'm generally pro-piracy and don't know the details here, but am also old enough for "the people like MONEY" to not be a particularly noteworthy quality. The things that jump out to me here are A) is Cloudflare's attempted implication that they just need a better injunction true? B) The sophomoric argument that "people will die due to this" is my "people like…

I’m gonna argue that piracy is the only thing keeping platforms somewhat in check to not get completely enshittified. I stopped pirating stuff when content platforms gave a compelling easy to use product, I’m back to pirating because it’s genuinely a better product compared to the endless hoops you have to jump through to use streaming services

"Endless hoops"?

Re: Cloudflare CEO: Football piracy blocks will claim lives

#133

Post by zpeti »

twixfel wrote: post #112
briandear wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Why put Hungary in scare quotes? It's right wing nationalist and undermining our (Europe's) defence against the ultrafascist Russian hordes invading from the East. It's not the same.

[flagged]

Re: Cloudflare CEO: Football piracy blocks will claim lives

#135

Post by AlotOfReading »

haiku2077 wrote: post #118
AlotOfReading wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How are streaming sites registering new domains and getting the site info out to the audience in that time frame? I suspect they're not and there's actually a period there's a window of weeks or longer for enforcement actions to be taken.

Preregister domain names, distribute then via chat apps like signal or whatsapp or telegram.

Whatsapp has mechanisms to prevent this kind of thing by blocking the messages from being sent, but I guess I'm confused about how this works financially. Sports streaming (especially something like La Liga) is the textbook example of a mass market product. The vast majority of the audience isn't technically sophisticated, and live streaming infrastructure is expensive. Pirate sites need a reasonably large audience to make money. I find it hard to believe that there's enough reach for people waiting to click on random links in private signal chats to make pirate streaming a viable business when people can just go to a bar or a friend's house. Is that really happening at any meaningful scale?

Re: Cloudflare CEO: Football piracy blocks will claim lives

#136

Post by KaiserPro »

So on the one hand I am sympathetic. On the otherhand, I'm also pretty sure cloudflare won't take down pirated stuff, so what do they expect?

I don't like the way that large football conglomerates abuse copyright, but then those same rules _should_ be open to me for anything I produce. The main difference is I don't have a team of lawyers.

Re: Cloudflare CEO: Football piracy blocks will claim lives

#137

Post by SXX »

vvpan wrote: post #55

I am somehow out of the loop about why Cloudflare is as big as it is? There are many other CDNs, why them?

Free tier that let you hide your server IPs, cheap domain registry (with no margin) and even some also tunnels for zero trust. Like I used them for a lot of personal and tbh even commercial projects for years paying them $0. Also they have bandidth alliance with Backblaze so you can serve 100s of TBs for free.

So there a lot of convinience and free stuff. It's quite obviously that when I had commercial customers where for whatever reason free tier wasn't anough I juse used them as well. Why not? There are horror stories about their corporate pricing, but for smaller company paying $20-200 for CDN is no brainer.

Also huge massive advantage of CloudFlare is that majority of their services are not metered so it's hard to wake up to $100,000 bill like it can happen with AWS and almost any other CDN provider.

I still believe this kind of centralized MiTM is bad for us all, but honestly I'd rather it be CloudFlare than Amazon, Microsoft or some other "evil corp".

Re: Cloudflare CEO: Football piracy blocks will claim lives

#138

Post by mvdtnz »

neilv wrote: post #109
brookst wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mandating 100% availability sounds like regulating pi to 3.0. It can’t be done. If someone is on a home network whose router has been compromised and is part of a ddos attack, there’s no way their innocent HTTP traffic is getting through. Ditto if their machine has been compromised. Lots of scenarios where an innocent user must be blocked, unless the entire internet is reinvented. Which is beyond the scope of my proj…

> It can’t be done. If someone is on a home network whose router has been compromised and is part of a ddos attack, there’s no way their innocent HTTP traffic is getting through. Ditto if their machine has been compromised. To me, this sounds like giving up way too easily on engineering problems. One distinction to start with: Let's say grandma's router isn't part of a DDoS attack. Even if she might be trying to talk…

The people behind Cloudflare spend all day, every day trying to solve these kinds of problems. They're just not as simple as you make it sound.

Re: Cloudflare CEO: Football piracy blocks will claim lives

#139

Post by globie »

wmf wrote: post #130
globie wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This conclusion stems from that it is much easier to launch a DDoS from a single server w/ spoofed traffic than to use a botnet. If you have a single 10Gig server, you will likely not be able to take down another 10Gig server unless the target is already doing near 1gbps[0]. I believe most "noise" DDoS which effects random website operators is considerably less than 10Gbps, and pretty much every giant attack uses spo…

DDoS is distributed denial of service. It isn't coming from one server. It's now trivial to buy 100 Gbps or more of DDoS so sites would need 400G or more to simply eat it.

If you have a single server flooding spoofed traffic, it appears as a DDoS to the victim. It's at this point that the distinction between DoS/DDoS breaks down slightly.

It is very much not "trivial" to buy 100Gbps+ of DDoS. I'm highly confident the majority of D/DoS attacks are from single servers, because it works. If you have a 10Gbit server and your target has 1Gbit (or you 1Gbit and them 100Mbit, it still happens), it's not a question of if you can take the target down, but how long you can sustain that traffic level before your upstream notices.

Painting every D/DoS as the most bandwidth ever is a play out of Cloudflare's marketing. If every website operator knew that 1, you don't need that much bigger of a pipe, and 2, you shouldn't buy pipes that charge you $20+/TB like AWS anyway, then Cloudflare would have a much harder time selling you a downgrade in quality, and we would have faster and cheaper networks to boot.

Re: Cloudflare CEO: Football piracy blocks will claim lives

#140

Post by genewitch »

zpeti wrote: post #133
twixfel wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why put Hungary in scare quotes? It's right wing nationalist and undermining our (Europe's) defence against the ultrafascist Russian hordes invading from the East. It's not the same.

[flagged]

Same thing this time around, Germany is oiling the war machine to march through Poland and fight Russia again, as we comment.
Post reply on HN