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Spaced repetition can allow for infinite recall (2022)

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Re: Spaced repetition can allow for infinite recall (2022)

#131

Post by wahnfrieden »

I made a well-received native iOS/macOS app for mining Japanese web and ebook content (Mokuro manga up next) into Anki or my own companion flashcard app: https://reader.manabi.io

I'm now working on flashcard auto-reviews while reading, so that if you read words/kanji that you have cards for, it'll automatically mark those cards as reviewed rather than ask you to recall them shortly after you just had to recall during your reading.

I hope this helps people replace more SRS time with actual reading (or listening)

Re: Spaced repetition can allow for infinite recall (2022)

#132

Post by runarberg »

wahnfrieden wrote: post #126
runarberg wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used the same binding for a kanji learning app ( https://shodoku.app ). I had some problems with their documentation though. Following their examples was pretty straightforward, but I always had trouble e.g. what is the difference between State.Learning and State.Relearning, or what does fuzzy mean in FSRS parameters, or reps on a Card. You have to either read the algorithm explainer or the Anki source code to unde…

Can’t read Anki source unless your work is GPL. Could you share the insights yourself?

My work is MIT, as is ts-fsrs. I said anki source code, but I was being hyperbolic. To understand the different exports of ts-fsrs I had to browse around in different repos at https://github.com/open-spaced-repetition (particularly rs-fsrs; which I think is used in Anki proper) as well as read the algorithm https://github.com/open-spaced-repetition/fsrs4anki/wiki/The... and infer by names being used.

I complain here, but this is open source and if I was slightly more ambitious I would submit PR with the missing docs (or at least an issue).

PS. my work is here https://github.com/runarberg/shodoku in case you are interested, but the source code bears the mark of being a weekend hobby project, so read at own risk ;)

Re: Spaced repetition can allow for infinite recall (2022)

#133

Post by zozbot234 »

purplethinking wrote: post #54

I've done the whole spaced repetition and Anki thing, realized that if it's boring, you won't learn as well, and you won't stick with it in the long term, once you miss a week and suddenly you have 863 reps to get through to catch up. Instead, read stuff you're interested, apply it in your work, learn mostly Just In Time for when you need it. Learn by doing.

> once you miss a week and suddenly you have 863 reps to get through to catch up.

You only have to "catch up" ASAP if you want to minimize the risk of forgetting any card at all, and then having to memorize it again. Otherwise, just working through the backlog at your preferred pace is the best strategy; you'll still be recalling most of the cards and the system will push repetitions for those that you do recall further out in time.

Perhaps the Anki devs should add some kind of special workflow in the UX that shows up when the user has a huge backlog to go through due to missed reviews, and tells them this. Because you're right that just seeing a bare number (863 cards to go through!) can be quite scary.

Re: Spaced repetition can allow for infinite recall (2022)

#134

Post by wahnfrieden »

runarberg wrote: post #132
wahnfrieden wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can’t read Anki source unless your work is GPL. Could you share the insights yourself?

My work is MIT, as is ts-fsrs. I said anki source code, but I was being hyperbolic. To understand the different exports of ts-fsrs I had to browse around in different repos at https://github.com/open-spaced-repetition (particularly rs-fsrs; which I think is used in Anki proper) as well as read the algorithm https://github.com/open-spaced-repetition/fsrs4anki/wiki/The... and infer by names being used. I complain here,…

Thanks for sharing details

I'd like to port my own flashcards app, Manabi from SM2 to FSRS so this is helpful

I made this companion reader app as well, btw, for learning Japanese: https://reader.manabi.io

Re: Spaced repetition can allow for infinite recall (2022)

#135

Post by hiAndrewQuinn »

aerhardt wrote: post #104

Anyone had any experience using spaced repetition for reinforcing math learning?

I used it in my abstract algebra classes

I basically only put two things in there: "Prove X" and my ordinary problems. Then I'd just do that. Those cards usually took at least a minute apiece, but I got really good at abstract algebra, at least when compared to similarly skilled peers. Mind you, I have always been good (perfect SAT score) but not great (never scouted for Putnam) at math.

Contrary to what you might think, memorizing definitions is less useful (though not totally useless) than memorizing the proofs of theorems which rely upon those definitions.

I would almost certainly go back to doing this if I ever want for a master's degree with a math class again. The idea crosses my mind every now and then to do it with linear algebra, which counterintuitively isn't actually a prerequisite for or all that similar to abstract algebra.

Re: Spaced repetition can allow for infinite recall (2022)

#136

Post by david_allison »

hinkley wrote: post #129
david_allison wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The site's a great rabbit hole to go down for a few days. Woz is the father of digital spaced repetition. Be aware that it's not peer reviewed, and some of the findings take a lot of experimentation if you want to dive deep and reproduce them. My understanding is that his thoughts on sleep are pretty controversial within the sleep optimization community.

I used to dabble in the sleep space since my circadian rhythm is shot anyway. But the self reporting aspects of the “data” always made me suspicious. People in certain phases of sleep dep, hypoxia, or a number of other debilitating events don’t know they’re experiencing symptoms until someone else tells them they are. That’s why you’re trained to look for signs in others. So I am sorry but I don’t trust you if you te…

There was a HN post a few months ago, [sadly I can't find it] which correlated healthy sleep with faster card answering times in Anki.

I haven't used Supermemo, but believe it has fairly strong sleep tracking capabilities.

I've dabbled about doing the same in AnkiDroid. We could pull data from Android Health, and do something interesting with it, but we've got hundreds of other things to do, Google will probably pull our app from the Play Store if we request health data, and it at the moment it's a little out-of-scope and would be better for an addon using our API

Re: Spaced repetition can allow for infinite recall (2022)

#137

Post by david_allison »

runarberg wrote: post #86
L_i_m_n wrote: post #24

FSRS is a really clever iteration on Anki's SM2 algorithm. I've been playing around with various spaced repetition implementations lately - there's a great collection of open source libraries at github.com/open-spaced-repetition. I ended up using their typescript bindings for a vocabulary builder I'm working on (deft.so) and it's been surprisingly straightforward to implement.

I used the same binding for a kanji learning app ( https://shodoku.app ). I had some problems with their documentation though. Following their examples was pretty straightforward, but I always had trouble e.g. what is the difference between State.Learning and State.Relearning, or what does fuzzy mean in FSRS parameters, or reps on a Card. You have to either read the algorithm explainer or the Anki source code to unde…

On the Anki side: if you document it, I'll answer questions.

Re: Spaced repetition can allow for infinite recall (2022)

#138

Post by runarberg »

wahnfrieden wrote: post #134
runarberg wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My work is MIT, as is ts-fsrs. I said anki source code, but I was being hyperbolic. To understand the different exports of ts-fsrs I had to browse around in different repos at https://github.com/open-spaced-repetition (particularly rs-fsrs; which I think is used in Anki proper) as well as read the algorithm https://github.com/open-spaced-repetition/fsrs4anki/wiki/The... and infer by names being used. I complain here,…

Thanks for sharing details I'd like to port my own flashcards app, Manabi from SM2 to FSRS so this is helpful I made this companion reader app as well, btw, for learning Japanese: https://reader.manabi.io

Nice. I jumped straight to FSRS so I can’t compare, but so far I have no regrets. One of my features is I progressively disappear the furigana in the included dictionary and example sentences, as the reading proficiency of the kanji increases (specifically at 99% retrievability) https://github.com/runarberg/shodoku/blob/main/src/helpers/f... This feature was very easy to implement as retrievability is inherent in the algorithm (maybe it is in SM2 as well; I don’t know; but it was trivial in FSRS).

This library also makes it easy to undo a review (one of my missing features) as long as you keep the review records (which this library also makes easy).

Re: Spaced repetition can allow for infinite recall (2022)

#139

Post by joshdavham »

runarberg wrote: post #86
L_i_m_n wrote: post #24

FSRS is a really clever iteration on Anki's SM2 algorithm. I've been playing around with various spaced repetition implementations lately - there's a great collection of open source libraries at github.com/open-spaced-repetition. I ended up using their typescript bindings for a vocabulary builder I'm working on (deft.so) and it's been surprisingly straightforward to implement.

I used the same binding for a kanji learning app ( https://shodoku.app ). I had some problems with their documentation though. Following their examples was pretty straightforward, but I always had trouble e.g. what is the difference between State.Learning and State.Relearning, or what does fuzzy mean in FSRS parameters, or reps on a Card. You have to either read the algorithm explainer or the Anki source code to unde…

> I had some problems with their documentation though.

I agree that our documentation is pretty bad at the moment haha. But I'm hoping we'll start cleaning things up more this year. I'd also like to potentially move away from using github's wiki system...

Re: Spaced repetition can allow for infinite recall (2022)

#140

Post by hinkley »

david_allison wrote: post #136
hinkley wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to dabble in the sleep space since my circadian rhythm is shot anyway. But the self reporting aspects of the “data” always made me suspicious. People in certain phases of sleep dep, hypoxia, or a number of other debilitating events don’t know they’re experiencing symptoms until someone else tells them they are. That’s why you’re trained to look for signs in others. So I am sorry but I don’t trust you if you te…

There was a HN post a few months ago, [sadly I can't find it] which correlated healthy sleep with faster card answering times in Anki. I haven't used Supermemo, but believe it has fairly strong sleep tracking capabilities. I've dabbled about doing the same in AnkiDroid. We could pull data from Android Health, and do something interesting with it, but we've got hundreds of other things to do, Google will probably pull…

I complained on that one about how repeating tests like this usually results in better answers over time so the fact the author saw the same results may mean no negative effects, or just very slow decline. Which tells us something interesting but doesn’t mean it’s necessarily harmless.

You have to be careful and spread your tests over a bunch of subjects to find the patterns.

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