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A comparison to Waymo’s auto liability insurance claims at 25M miles

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Re: A comparison to Waymo’s auto liability insurance claims at 25M miles

#131

Post by mulmen »

mstade wrote: post #105
mulmen wrote: post #56

I rode in a Waymo recently and was amazed at how good it was. It was easily in the top 5 best drivers I have ridden with. Really really impressive. It wasn’t nearly as cautious or timid as I expected it to be. But it also wasn’t reckless. I would describe it as assertive, but I’m sure some people would call it aggressive. It knows the rules and what’s going on around and acts accordingly. This really should be the no…

I was just in CA for a few weeks and drove in SF quite a bit. There are Waymo cars everywhere and from the perspective of a driver I was more than a little cautious driving behind or next to one of them. I would rate their driving as quite good, but their signaling of intent was terrible. More than once did I see them use turn signals, only to never actually turn. Turn the signals on, then off again, then on again, e…

Good point about intent. As a passenger I appreciated how smooth it was but I can see how the lack of “body language” could be disorienting for human drivers.

The Waymo driving style is almost passive-aggressive. It has superhuman situational awareness and knowledge. I wonder if it isn’t using blinkers effectively but it’s everyone else that’s technically wrong.

It’s also not perfect so who knows. There’s probably still bugs to work out.

Re: A comparison to Waymo’s auto liability insurance claims at 25M miles

#133

Post by jonasdn »

zigzag312 wrote: post #123

I would be interested in comparison to human drivers excluding humans driving under influence. We know that humans under influence are really bad drivers. So bad, that DUI is illegal. Stats commonly include accidents caused these drivers.

Is this not the "no-true-scotsman" fallacy? (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman)

Re: A comparison to Waymo’s auto liability insurance claims at 25M miles

#134

Post by JumpCrisscross »

rglullis wrote: post #116
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the story of NASA's space pen As an example of an urban legend/facile pop science take being treated as fact [1]? > if the richest country in the world had the common sense of simply getting rid of its car dependency and developed proper public transit infrastructure Is there a single developed economy that doesn't make significant use of trucks and cars? [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_Pen#Uses_in_the_U.S.…

Way to miss the point. Yes, it is known that the "NASA space pen" was not really funded by NASA, but but its development still took millions of dollars in R&D. > Is there a single developed economy that doesn't make significant use of trucks and cars? For the 127th time: car dependency is not the same as car usage.

> its development still took millions of dollars in R&D

$1mm at the time, $10mm today. They sold for the equivalent of $30 each in today's money and saved manned spaceflight from having to deal with graphite shards in the air and electrical.

> car dependency is not the same as car usage

"If the richest country in the world" got "rid of its car dependency," we'd still want safer cars.

Re: A comparison to Waymo’s auto liability insurance claims at 25M miles

#135

Post by aithrowawaycomm »

viraptor wrote: post #96
aithrowawaycomm wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is apples-to-apples. You need to somehow filter to people who are not speeding or otherwise breaking traffic laws. My problem with studies like these is "human-operated" is an enormous catch-all that blends together too many causes for accidents. 1) Not filtering out drunk drivers is downright misleading. I am less interested in "is mandatory self-driving safer than human drivers?" than "is mandato…

It depends what you want to know. "Are autonomous cars better than good drivers?", or "am I safer in Waymo than a random human driven taxi?". Both are very valid questions.

But "random human-driven taxi" is arbitrary since random humans are not driving taxis. This study doesn't at all show that Waymos are safer than Ubers driven by Uber drivers (though I suspect that is the case).

Re: A comparison to Waymo’s auto liability insurance claims at 25M miles

#136

Post by mulmen »

kiba wrote: post #127
mulmen wrote: post #56

I rode in a Waymo recently and was amazed at how good it was. It was easily in the top 5 best drivers I have ridden with. Really really impressive. It wasn’t nearly as cautious or timid as I expected it to be. But it also wasn’t reckless. I would describe it as assertive, but I’m sure some people would call it aggressive. It knows the rules and what’s going on around and acts accordingly. This really should be the no…

It's impressive and all, but my reaction to self driving cars are completely different. It's a great technical feat, but it's not ever going to be efficient as public transportation. The form factor of the car works against it.

Make a self driving bus then. I take Ubers to bus stops today. Doesn’t seem like much of a leap.

Re: A comparison to Waymo’s auto liability insurance claims at 25M miles

#137

Post by fragmede »

kiba wrote: post #127
mulmen wrote: post #56

I rode in a Waymo recently and was amazed at how good it was. It was easily in the top 5 best drivers I have ridden with. Really really impressive. It wasn’t nearly as cautious or timid as I expected it to be. But it also wasn’t reckless. I would describe it as assertive, but I’m sure some people would call it aggressive. It knows the rules and what’s going on around and acts accordingly. This really should be the no…

It's impressive and all, but my reaction to self driving cars are completely different. It's a great technical feat, but it's not ever going to be efficient as public transportation. The form factor of the car works against it.

Once the technology exists and is proven, the only thing stopping public transportation from being automated with the same technology is their union.

Re: A comparison to Waymo’s auto liability insurance claims at 25M miles

#138

Post by gizmondo »

rglullis wrote: post #86
mulmen wrote: post #56

I rode in a Waymo recently and was amazed at how good it was. It was easily in the top 5 best drivers I have ridden with. Really really impressive. It wasn’t nearly as cautious or timid as I expected it to be. But it also wasn’t reckless. I would describe it as assertive, but I’m sure some people would call it aggressive. It knows the rules and what’s going on around and acts accordingly. This really should be the no…

The whole thing with self-driving cars is that it feels like the story of NASA's space pen. All this money being poured into a technology that would not be needed if the richest country in the world had the common sense of simply getting rid of its car dependency and developed proper public transit infrastructure.

I live in Switzerland which has a reputation for having good public transport. Still own a car because in many cases you can't beat convenience. Can't wait for Waymo to come here.

Re: A comparison to Waymo’s auto liability insurance claims at 25M miles

#139

Post by metalman »

fake, fake, lying, no conection to the reality of what is needed for 90% of short trips on roads. millions of trips an hour require going into tight, poorly lit, uneven , and unmaped ,end destinations, that are where a huge amount of the included "bodily injury" is happening, and waymo is never going into. Add in other realitys like, heavy acqward baggage and cargo, tools, food, kids,dogs, etc,etc that waymo (wayno) aint carrying and there is no comparison to be made. curb to curb, nicy nice areas, if you dont mind going slow inside a robot, by yourself, and pay through the nose, then sure, whatever but WHEN, one of these things runs over someones kid, expect a backlash , right

Re: A comparison to Waymo’s auto liability insurance claims at 25M miles

#140

Post by lastdong »

rglullis wrote: post #86
mulmen wrote: post #56

I rode in a Waymo recently and was amazed at how good it was. It was easily in the top 5 best drivers I have ridden with. Really really impressive. It wasn’t nearly as cautious or timid as I expected it to be. But it also wasn’t reckless. I would describe it as assertive, but I’m sure some people would call it aggressive. It knows the rules and what’s going on around and acts accordingly. This really should be the no…

The whole thing with self-driving cars is that it feels like the story of NASA's space pen. All this money being poured into a technology that would not be needed if the richest country in the world had the common sense of simply getting rid of its car dependency and developed proper public transit infrastructure.

If it succeeds, self-driving technology is likely to be integrated into public transit systems, enhancing their reliability and overall efficiency.
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