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What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

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Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#131

Post by gruez »

markdown wrote: post #126
gruez wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can turn off your phone or go into airplane mode. Can you do that with your car? Even if most people don't use that option on a daily basis, doesn't mean it's fine.

So you put it in airplane mode while in a car and then disable airplane mode when you get to your destination? What's the point of that?

>then disable airplane mode when you get to your destination?

Why would I need to disable it? If you're not using the built-in navigation (which probably costs money anyways) and are using carplay/android auto instead, you should be able to leave it in airplane mode indefinitely. What critical functionality would I be missing out on?

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#132

Post by tomrod »

madaxe_again wrote: post #130
tomrod wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a super dumb outcome for your poor mother. Abandoned property is just that.

In France it’s only counted as abandoned if it is more than 30 years. These guys rocked up at something like 29 years and 9 months, and because there had been a verbal agreement that they would one day collect, and my mother allowed it, she was deemed to have stolen property she was entrusted to store. She was actually lucky to avoid criminal charges.

I maintain that this is a dumb (i.e. completely unreasonable) outcome for your mother.

Abandonment should be measured at the takeover of property in lieu of agreement, and a reasonable time frame for pickup agreement is on the order of days, not years.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#134

Post by wutwutwat »

rcpt wrote: post #79
afh1 wrote: post #25

The scary part is not the GPS installed by the fleet company that previously owned the car, which in all likelihood was just forgotten there, but the GPS and eSIM that comes with most (all?) new cars and that in most (all?) new cars cannot be disabled. Apart from privacy concerns of your data being used or sold by the car vendor, government outreach is also a concern. There was a bill announced in the US for all new…

> a kill switch The funny thing is that's what cars do to other people because we don't have enough monitoring. My e-bike is limited to 20 because "safety". Your car should be to.

One requires a licensed operator. One doesn’t. One requires liability insurance. One doesn’t.

Complain about power wheels, because you’re comparing two things that have nothing to do with each other.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#135

Post by Ichthypresbyter »

rcpt wrote: post #79
afh1 wrote: post #25

The scary part is not the GPS installed by the fleet company that previously owned the car, which in all likelihood was just forgotten there, but the GPS and eSIM that comes with most (all?) new cars and that in most (all?) new cars cannot be disabled. Apart from privacy concerns of your data being used or sold by the car vendor, government outreach is also a concern. There was a bill announced in the US for all new…

> a kill switch The funny thing is that's what cars do to other people because we don't have enough monitoring. My e-bike is limited to 20 because "safety". Your car should be to.

Your ebike is limited because it can legally be operated by anybody (including a child) without needing any kind of license. If you want to legally operate a faster electric two-wheeled vehicle, take the test to get a motorbike license.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#136

Post by markdown »

gruez wrote: post #131
markdown wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you put it in airplane mode while in a car and then disable airplane mode when you get to your destination? What's the point of that?

>then disable airplane mode when you get to your destination? Why would I need to disable it? If you're not using the built-in navigation (which probably costs money anyways) and are using carplay/android auto instead, you should be able to leave it in airplane mode indefinitely. What critical functionality would I be missing out on?

Well... for most people... everything.

It sounds like you use a dumb phone. Anyone who takes this stuff seriously enough to use a dumb phone will be buying a dumb car.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#137

Post by dylan604 »

6SixTy wrote: post #91
Etheryte wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Electric cars are essentially black boxes. When you take it apart, you have largely no idea what any of the chips do, even if you chase down what they're connected to. Is this the infotainment system or is it the infotainment system and a data gathering system that sends all my data off seas? There's no way to know. Old cars don't have that problem. Here's an engine, here's a gearbox, add a radio if you'd like, but b…

Problem with gathering data off cars is that it's really not that effective vs your phone. A car realistically just sits around doing nothing 80% of the time, while a phone is with you 24/7, likely powered 24/7, and already has telemetry mechanisms built in. An old car with someone using a phone probably still collects the same data as you assert. And an EV without smarts is legitimately just a golf cart.

> likely powered 24/7,

This is a weird thing to call out. I'd suggest a car is powered as much as a phone. I'm trying to decide for people that have a car and a phone which is more infuriating to not have power.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#138

Post by zymhan »

nlawalker wrote: post #60
realityking wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s surprisingly common for SIMs in IoT devices to not be locked down. If the data usage spikes enough above the noise it’ll probably be detected & deactivated. Here’s an example from a few years ago: https://scootertalk.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1370

Nice. Thought this was going to be https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22085089

I'm reminded of a sim card installed in tracker for wildlife, that was then used by someone for their cellphone.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#139

Post by imiric »

treyd wrote: post #100
imiric wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem isn't with governments. It's with people. Most people don't care about their privacy. Even if they do, the majority of that group don't care enough to give up the conveniences they get in exchange for it. This leaves a small group of people to fight for protecting their privacy, as well as of those who don't care about it. This is an uphill battle against trillion-dollar corporations and the governments t…

I've more recently found that "laypeople" really do care about their privacy and but are unaware about what data it's possible for corporations to collect. They do rightfully uncomfortable when they have their questions answered, but feel powerless to be able to do anything about it.

That hasn't been my experience. Maybe that was the case 10+ years ago, but most people these days understand what they're giving up when using these services. The argument then becomes "I have nothing to hide", "I only use it occasionally", "What's the worst that could happen?", etc. It all boils down to them valuing the experience they're getting over their privacy. I've had these conversations with both technical and nontechnical people, and in nearly all cases I've had to argue in favor of privacy. I've yet to convince anyone to change their habits.

I share and empathize with the feeling of powerlessness, but most people will choose convenience, user experience, etc. over privacy, even when there are reasonable alternatives. Hell, I will sacrifice my own privacy if a service is indispensable and there's no alternative. We can't expect people who value it less to do otherwise.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#140

Post by akira2501 »

Gee101 wrote: post #111
afh1 wrote: post #25

The scary part is not the GPS installed by the fleet company that previously owned the car, which in all likelihood was just forgotten there, but the GPS and eSIM that comes with most (all?) new cars and that in most (all?) new cars cannot be disabled. Apart from privacy concerns of your data being used or sold by the car vendor, government outreach is also a concern. There was a bill announced in the US for all new…

I'm sure there will be kits to swap the ice engine to eletricfor most popular cars eventually. Then you will have more control about what features is added.

I've seen people do this but I think it's unlikely. The weight on an ICE car is slung much differently from an EV and placing a battery bank where your engine used to be is not a great idea.
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