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Nearly 8 years later and you still seriously believe Trump won the 2016 election via Russian interference? Even after all investigations yielded no evidence?
Julian Assange granted permission to appeal against extradition to US
131–140 of 225 posts
Re: Julian Assange granted permission to appeal against extradition to US
#132Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, it is considered a cardinal sin to discredit authority through embarrassment. It may not be an official crime, but they will make it feel that way. This isn't unique to governments. Try discrediting any authority figure with embarassment (parent, teacher, manager, police) and watch what happens. The result somewhat irrational and ego driven, but it's relatively consistent.
You know that's not true because if the US govt were what you seem to allege (extradites and arrests mere critics) then you wouldn't be safe to post this here. It's also a national pastime to crap on the government. Are you not aware that thousands of reporters and millions of people embarrass the US government every day?
You appear to have a different definition of "embarrass the government" than I do. Embarrassing a government is an action that they are willing to kill people over (like reporters). There's a big difference between leaking state secrets that materially harms the government and poking fun at them. One will get you disappeared and tortured-not-tortured, the other is a useful distraction.
Re: Julian Assange granted permission to appeal against extradition to US
#133Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, it is considered a cardinal sin to discredit authority through embarrassment. It may not be an official crime, but they will make it feel that way. This isn't unique to governments. Try discrediting any authority figure with embarassment (parent, teacher, manager, police) and watch what happens. The result somewhat irrational and ego driven, but it's relatively consistent.
You know that's not true because if the US govt were what you seem to allege (extradites and arrests mere critics) then you wouldn't be safe to post this here. It's also a national pastime to crap on the government. Are you not aware that thousands of reporters and millions of people embarrass the US government every day?
Lions don't attack every animal that sets foot on their turf.
The release of "Collateral Murder" damaged public opinion of the US invasion of Iraq and US foreign policy in general. If journalists embarrass the US government by telling them their nose looks funny, Assange embarrassed them by pulling their pants down at the half time show at the Superbowl.
Re: Julian Assange granted permission to appeal against extradition to US
#134Given that the US is not a signatory to several international treaties and regularly employs solitary confinement, which is internationally considered as a form of torture, there is a humanitarian argument against the extradition. The desire to comply with the extradition request seems to be more about politics (i.e. maintaining good relationships with the US) than the rule of law. The treatment of Manning should be…
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It would be interesting to see you or anyone with your opinion about solitary spend even six months in U.S. Federal/state supermax levels of isolation and then emerge to say with a straight face and sound mind that it isn't torture.
Humans are innately social animals, and isolating them against their will from virtually all human contact even for fairly short periods of time can be more destructive to their being than physically mutilating them, even if the scars won't be so visible. Whether such a punishment is justified for some types of extreme criminals or not is another argument that we could debate, but let's at least be honest about describing it for the cruelty it is as a method.
Total supermax-type solitary is one very major reason why even some of the wold's hardest criminals in other countries fight extradition to the U.S at all costs. Should someone like Assange be placed at the same moral level as a mass murdering Mexican narco boss?
Re: Julian Assange granted permission to appeal against extradition to US
#135Earlier quoted context omitted.
Arguably, the rest of the "free world" can be seen as provinces of an American Empire with their independence. From that perspective, the Assange extradition makes perfect sense. This isn't as crazy as it sounds because the Roman Empire had provinces which were technically "independent" monarchies aligned with Rome. Most famously, Egypt under Cleopatra and Judea under Herod.
If you believe “free world” should be in quotes you need to travel more or talk to more expats. Maybe we really do need a little dance with authoritarianism here to remind people what that is.
Traveller and expat here - "free world" is absolutely correct.
Even its allies aren't free of government interference from the US.
Re: Julian Assange granted permission to appeal against extradition to US
#136Earlier quoted context omitted.
The US has exerted unbelievable pressure to ensure Assange remains a non-threat. Just because they're happy with the current state of affairs doesn't mean Assange has anything to gain by "facing the court and just getting it over with". The best outcome would be for the UK to uphold its own treaties, refuse to extradite Assange, and allow him to walk free. Anything less would be a travesty and miscarriage of justice.…
He will have to be put on trial (by a jury if he so elects) and convicted before he goes to prison; there is no automatic conviction and even if he is refuse bail he will not be in prison. If the UK refuses to extradite him, then it's a matter of his looking over his shoulder for the rest of his life waiting for the hood and a chopper out. Besides, I have no faith in the UK court' ability to do anything here; they're…
I believe your hope that he will face anything like a fair trial in the US is misplaced. The conviction the US seeks under the Espionage Act is as good as automatic. There are books and numerous articles covering in minute detail the extraordinary nature of his persecution, detailing the numerous perversions of justice involved.
Re: Julian Assange granted permission to appeal against extradition to US
#137As someone who wants to see Assange go free, I continue to believe the best outcome here is for him to be extradited and face trial in the US. I do not think the government's case is strong enough to convict him, and his being acquitted at trial would be by far the best outcome possible here. The fact that he has been imprisoned in the UK without trial or conviction for the last four years is insane (he has been impr…
Honestly, do you believe he would receive a fair and impartial trial in the united states?
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Re: Julian Assange granted permission to appeal against extradition to US
#138Earlier quoted context omitted.
Wrecklessly and without simple redaction, in such a way that very well might have resulted in the deaths of US officials. And highly questionable selective publishing. I think the guy is getting fucked over in this unfairly, but let's not pretend he has released information to a reasonable standard.
He has also been selective in his releases and timed them to affect political outcomes. He’s just another biased media source with an agenda.
Of course he wants to affect political outcomes. Is that not the entire point? The US is committing war crimes, why would he _not_ want this to change?
Also, how would unbiased reporting on war crimes look like?
Lastly, does "having an agenda", whatever that might mean to you, change anything about the facts that were presented? Does it make the crimes the US is committing any less severe?
Re: Julian Assange granted permission to appeal against extradition to US
#139Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I continue to believe the best outcome here is for him to be extradited and face trial in the US. Lol... They would send him in a secret military prison... That would be the worst outcome possible... He should have went where Snowden wanted to go or where he is by accident
Sure, they'll send him to the same secret military prison where they store the UFOs. Assange is a public figure; if extradited he will have a trial, and if convicted will go to the same federal prisons that all people convicted for federal crimes go to. The US has engaged in "extraordinary rendition" (many of which we only know about because of Assange). I'm not defending their record here, but Assange is not a candi…
They're storing UFOs in Guantanamo Bay now?
Re: Julian Assange granted permission to appeal against extradition to US
#140[flagged]
While there are bits of truth in this comment, much of it is exaggerated and unsubstantiated, namely: - Being a verified Russian asset - Working with Russia to specifically help elect Trump to the office of president - Specifically seeking to weaken US democracy Going to need sources and supporting evidence proportionate to the extent of your claims.
Which bits are true?