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'I should not have written 'A Clockwork Orange''

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131–140 of 170 posts

Re: 'I should not have written 'A Clockwork Orange''

#131
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

House was at least in part based on Sherlock Holmes who infamously had his 7% Cocaine solution. It's not entirely unreasonable to think the writers of House would update that to be pills. Not everything is some vast conspiracy...

Except that this was such a small detail on Sherlock Holmes novels that few people remember it.

It's such a "small detail" that nearly every modern interpretation of the character likes to portray it for the "fans"

Re: 'I should not have written 'A Clockwork Orange''

#132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't place the blame on South Park. Kids are cruel. If they didn't pick up on the ginger joke, they would latch on to somebody else for some other innocuous reason.

lol gingers/redheads/carrot tops etc etc have been picked on for at least as long as I remember... well over 40 years. kids are brutal

in bullying mode, kids are animals

Re: 'I should not have written 'A Clockwork Orange''

#133
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it’s not that interesting. Bad guy decides being bad is boring, and starts being good? Like, okay, but… why?

How is that any more boring than the opposite?

Presumably because we see the actions and consequences attached to him deciding to be bad. If the good is only contained in one cursory final chapter, there's no substance to it. Might as well save it for a sequel.

Re: 'I should not have written 'A Clockwork Orange''

#134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

William Gibson is the father of Cyberpunk, not Steam Punk. Though if Gibson is the father, I might say Bester is the grandfather.

Alfred Bester has fallen into obscurity for sure. How do you figure Bester and not Lem as the grandfather?

John Brunner is closer to being a cyberpunk grandfather, imo

Re: 'I should not have written 'A Clockwork Orange''

#135

I think the most important aspect of "A Clockwork Orange" is it's use of language as a literary tool. It's also key to its misunderstanding, as it tends to lead towards secondary interpretations (i.e. Kubrick's film) more than the text itself. In addition to freewill being a key theme in the book, the nadsat language is used to disassociate the reader from the actions and events partaken in by the narrator. Alex desc…

Kubrick played his own tricks to dissociate the viewer from the onscreen violence. For example, the way the gang fight is set to classical music, in an abandoned theater, with cartoonish violence. And that fight is preceded by a gang rape staged like a ballet. It's the same technique in a different medium.

Re: 'I should not have written 'A Clockwork Orange''

#136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Im going to have to read that now. Loved Neuromancer, and Steam Punk is one of my favorite genres

Difference Engine starts great but then towards the end kind of fizzles out (IIRC, maybe I should read it again).

It was a Gibson-Sterling joint but you almost have to wonder if Stephenson ghostwrote the last bit.

Re: 'I should not have written 'A Clockwork Orange''

#137
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the weirdest and most interesting things I've ever seen was how this crazy book created gang violence by illustrating dystopian gang violence...And I can guarantee you that some of the youth ("hooligans") in England that were committing Droog gang violence -- inspired by this book -- have reformed as elderly adults. It's not unrealistic. When you remove people out of cults and gangs and they begin to self-refl…

Are you really suggesting that real gang violence was caused by a novel?

The article itself does much more than merely suggest it:

> Kubrick himself, in response to a series of murder trials where the defendants explicitly mentioned his work, requested the withdrawal of A Clockwork Orange in the United Kingdom, where it could not be seen again until the director’s death in 1999.

Re: 'I should not have written 'A Clockwork Orange''

#138
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what editors are supposed to do. And authors gaining editorial control is why so many books later in a popular author's career are worse and worse - no one able to trim them. As examples I'll pick Neal Stephenson and J.K. Rowling. Even the fans have to notice how their work has gotten bigger and sloppier.

Trimming the book is one thing, and I agree with you 100% on both examples. Removing the conclusion in a way that completely alters the message is another.

This happened with the Heinlein book "Podkayne of Mars" -- the original ending had one character dying and another character changing course because of it. The editor thought it too heavy for a kids' book and directed a rewrite where everyone lived.

Years later a new print included both endings and staged an essay contest to decide which is the "right" ending.

Re: 'I should not have written 'A Clockwork Orange''

#140
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree with the disagreements. We look naturally at the shock value of the violence but harshly reject the shock of a character turning around out of the blue. We never give "good" the privilege of irrationality.

Because it’s not that interesting. Bad guy decides being bad is boring, and starts being good? Like, okay, but… why?

Partly because complex empathy for others is built with experience, so the teenage main character eventually grows up.
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