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Austin takes a bet on tiny homes to ease homelessness

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Re: Austin takes a bet on tiny homes to ease homelessness

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have found that many people who receive housing benefits are very poor stewards of their personal resources. The first thing someone does when they get housed is to invite all their homeless friends over, to shower, to eat, to crash, to do drugs, to play games, whatever. So your typical Section 8 housing recipient is not just a single person/family benefiting from housing, they're dragging in their entire circle of…

What experience do you have with that? I've known plenty of Section 8 beneficiaries and none matched that description. Particularly the description of 'loser friends' is sickening - a stereotype of poverty. The people I know hold down multiple jobs while raising kids, or are elderly and can't work; all just like you and me. I also know people who work for urban housing authorities that administer it, and I've never h…

Oh, it happens all the time. My closest friends got on assistance and then got dumped because they couldn't resist flouting the simplest rules.

The places where I live are rife with crime, vandalism, and disruption, and it always turns out to begin with people who don't live here at all. They're just crashing at a friend's place.

The people who do get on federal assistance are the most stable and trustworthy. The people they drag into their lives are not eligible for that stuff, due to criminal records, mental illness, really intractable problems.

In the other place I lived, there were raucous parties, vandalised fixtures, scummy people just hanging around. One Holy Saturday I was about to leave for church, when someone was stabbed and left a trail of blood at my doorstep. There were numerous drug-related arrests. Once I came home around 8pm to meet a cop with an assault rifle, who advised me to hang back awhile because they were raiding the place across the way. I was eventually subpoenaed to a court case because I'd supposedly witnessed some dude damage property, who of course didn't live there.

The recertification process is full of checks on this behavior. Currently, they have a questionnaire with essay questions like, "What is fraud?" "What is the definition of a "visitor"?" and suchlike, because people just don't understand the difference between a temporary visitor and a live-in roommate who keeps their stuff there and sleeps on your couch or whatever.

It happens all the time, and in fact it's often the reason people become homeless in the first place, because they dragged over their loser friends, for a shower, a meal, some games, to crash on the couch, and the family of this person said to stop bringing drama and crime into our home. So the guy gets kicked out from an otherwise good home, because they are trying to keep the peace.

I was on the other end of this, in fact; when I was homeless, I would sometimes be invited over, you know, to shower, eat, crash or whatever, and my host would get in trouble, because I was not known and hadn't had a background check, or signed on to a lease or anything. Couch-surfers are often living in largesse of friends who informally vet them and those friends often risk eviction, because your typical lease agreement (not even Section 8, just a standard lease) prohibits long-term "visitors" who turn into "roommates" without legally signing on.

Re: Austin takes a bet on tiny homes to ease homelessness

#132

Homeless people often aren't homeless because they lack homes. It's a very loaded and misleading term. There are usually many other problems that they need help with, and homelessness is often just a symptom.

The majority of homeless people are homeless for economic or relationship reasons like loss of job/income, insufficient income, breakups and divorce, and lack of affordable housing[1]. The fastest growing demographic of homeless people are entire families. [1] https://homelesslaw.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/Homeless_...

When in SF I used to cycle through an underpass that was often used as camping by homeless people.

One day I saw a little girl (10?) and her younger brother standing next to a tent, staring right at me as I went to my 6 figure job.

No child anywhere should be homeless.

Re: Austin takes a bet on tiny homes to ease homelessness

#133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe this is an unique US situation where you are unable to scale down Walmart. Just make a Walmart Lite with no jeans or TVs but only food. Then these can be built practically everywhere, offering the same competitive prices. There are half dozen of chains like this in Russia and they often open on the other sides of same street.

Those have already existed in the US for a decade or two. They are called Walmart Neighborhood Market and they are basically just a regular grocery store.

Our Downtown area is replete with miniaturized grocery stores, pharmacies, and other amenities that are built into the landscape there. They have sprung up commensurately with the addition of loft-type housing and other developments which are actively luring middle-class workers to live there again, after a long period of rather blighted and lifeless downtown environs.

Back in 2008, my fiancée flew out from Catalonia to visit me, and we went on many outings using rented bicycles and public transit. One Saturday, I took her to see some museums near Downtown, and we transferred in Central Station, which was more or less deserted, except for some very brave pigeons. She looked around and she was downright incredulous about the lack of passersby. I told her this is totally typical because nobody views Downtown as a place to hang out or be entertained, it's a financial and business district where people go to work and then GTFO to their suburbs.

In Europe it is very different for her: typically people live and work right in the city center, and the suburbs are something else entirely.

Re: Austin takes a bet on tiny homes to ease homelessness

#134
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

BS. New housing in dense centers only increase the overall amount of human misery. It sucks jobs away, and it drives up the housing cost.

Well if you build them elsewhere you're not going to do much about the unhoused population downtown. That just leads to using police violence to forcibly segregate by class.... Anyway, housing is kind of fucked so long as americans consider it a private investment rather than a common good. How do you think we got in this mess to begin with?

> Anyway, housing is kind of fucked so long as americans consider it a private investment rather than a common good.

JeffSnazz for president 2024.

Re: Austin takes a bet on tiny homes to ease homelessness

#135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You seem to be ignoring reality. In most of America, a car is the only form of reliable transportation, and there is little to no bike infrastructure. Even if there was good bike infrastructure, everything is too damn far apart. A 50 year plan for infrastructure to change that doesn't do anything for homeless today. But a car might.

I understand it’s the only viable means of transortation. That is why it is an extremely bad idea to build more communities where a car is the only viable means of transportation. If you transition to walkable/bikable communities now, you will be able to keep wealthier people in the car centric communities while allowing poorer people to use the newer more walking/biking centric communities. If you go “but cars are t…

We can give cars to homeless people today, and also build walkable communities so that one day we don't need cars.

Re: Austin takes a bet on tiny homes to ease homelessness

#136
post #107
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's always a funny tension on the city trying to draw in artists to make a downtown area more palatable, too, in that good artists and good art is often intended as a challenge to the status quo - the goal is to make people uncomfortable. I say this as a Berkeley-living lefty: the left often seems to espouse policies whose practical outcomes far exceed their actual appetite for discomfort or willingness to engage…

I suspect the art itself is a red herring. When a city planner says "artist" what do they mean ?

Isn't the classic example of this something like NYC's Hells Kitchen or East Village or Meatpacking District that was, at some point, the cheap neighborhood that artists and musicians could live in on their irregular low salaries, but then when some of them inevitably get famous, that mystique turns it from the bad/cheap part of town into the hip part of town that rich people go to for underground clubs and wild art shows, and in 10 years none of those people that made the area cool still live there because it's now the most expensive place in the city.

I think city marketers see "artist" in the same way that a nightclub sees women, but with less power or follow through on giving them anything free that would attract or keep them there to attract the other people.

Everyone wants to live in a city with good live music _and_ listen to Spotify all day in their 1k/month apartment.

Re: Austin takes a bet on tiny homes to ease homelessness

#137
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

BS. New housing in dense centers only increase the overall amount of human misery. It sucks jobs away, and it drives up the housing cost.

Well if you build them elsewhere you're not going to do much about the unhoused population downtown. That just leads to using police violence to forcibly segregate by class.... Anyway, housing is kind of fucked so long as americans consider it a private investment rather than a common good. How do you think we got in this mess to begin with?

> Well if you build them elsewhere you're not going to do much about the unhoused population downtown.

Newsflash: neither would tiny houses. On the West Coast, the downtown homeless population is almost 100% drug addicts these days. No amount of housing can fix that.

And for the sane population (i.e. not fentanyl addicts), being AWAY from downtowns is a blessing.

> Anyway, housing is kind of fucked so long as americans consider it a private investment rather than a common good. How do you think we got in this mess to begin with?

We stopped building highways, and switched from Moses' model of building enough roads to the "urbanist" model. Where we put in transit that makes it easy to go to the downtown ONLY.

Re: Austin takes a bet on tiny homes to ease homelessness

#138
post #109
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, provide jobs outside of misery centrals (downtowns). This is coincidentally the ONLY way that will actually help housing affordability.

And public transport.

Nope. Building transit decreases affordability. Sad but true.

Re: Austin takes a bet on tiny homes to ease homelessness

#139
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, provide jobs outside of misery centrals (downtowns). This is coincidentally the ONLY way that will actually help housing affordability.

> misery centrals (downtowns) What makes downtowns "misery centrals"? In most cities, they are the most expensive places to live - they are the most expensive, nicest places to live in the world. That's part of the reason we have homelessness - $1700/month in Manhattan gets you something like 225 sq feet. There's no substitute for downtown - we can't, somewhere else, rebuild the transportation, infrastructure, buildi…

> What makes downtowns "misery centrals"?

Having to live without a backyard and in a small space, crowded with other people, and having to deal with constant traffic.

> In most cities, they are the most expensive places to live - they are the most expensive, nicest places to live in the world.

And that's EXACTLY what makes downtowns "misery centrals". An average person will NOT be able to afford a large comfortable apartment.

> Argument through condescending dismissal isn't persuasive, and doesn't prove anything.

The thing is, no city in the US managed to increase affordability by either building transit or increasing density. Not a single one.

I don't have data for all the world, but it also holds true for several European cities. Oh, and Tokyo in Japan.

Re: Austin takes a bet on tiny homes to ease homelessness

#140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> misery centrals (downtowns) What makes downtowns "misery centrals"? In most cities, they are the most expensive places to live - they are the most expensive, nicest places to live in the world. That's part of the reason we have homelessness - $1700/month in Manhattan gets you something like 225 sq feet. There's no substitute for downtown - we can't, somewhere else, rebuild the transportation, infrastructure, buildi…

> What makes downtowns "misery centrals"? Having to live without a backyard and in a small space, crowded with other people, and having to deal with constant traffic. > In most cities, they are the most expensive places to live - they are the most expensive, nicest places to live in the world. And that's EXACTLY what makes downtowns "misery centrals". An average person will NOT be able to afford a large comfortable a…

It sounds like it would be miserable for you, a preference you are entitled to, of course.

At the same time, many, many people love it. In NYC alone millions of people pay astronomical rents and mortgages for the privilege of living in tiny spaces in close quarters, no yards, etc. They have for generations. And then we can add everyone in all the other cities, all over the wealthy part of the world, doing the same. As comparison, I wonder what the highest-demand suburban location is in the US and in the world, and where it ranks for housing costs?

It's not 'misery central', just something where you have a different preference.

> no city in the US managed to increase affordability by either building transit or increasing density. Not a single one.

Where does that come from? I understand we won't all have data all the time (I sure don't always), but until then, it's words.

P.S. Why are so many people using all caps in the last month or two? I hadn't seen much of that every on HN, iirc, and now it's all the rage. :)

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