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New JFK assassination revelation could upend the lone gunman theory

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Re: New JFK assassination revelation could upend the lone gunman theory

#131

Post by WalterBright »

kelnos wrote: post #98

Even if Landis is being honest to the best of his ability, this account seems suspect for one simple reason: human memory is incredibly unreliable even in routine cases. Considering the stress and trauma around witnessing and being so close to an awful event like that, as well as the amount of time that has passed, I don't see how we can consider this story to be even remotely reliable. He may truly remember these ev…

My dad kept a diary during his WW2 duty. In his 80's, he read it and was shocked to discover it did not line up with his memories.

Re: New JFK assassination revelation could upend the lone gunman theory

#132

Post by throw_m239339 »

h2odragon wrote: post #117
ip26 wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’s the anti-conspiratorial explanation for that? I can imagine a million different things they’d love to hide, but what would the legitimate, honest/harmless reason?

Hypothetical: They checked with an agent who is deep / high up in some foreign agency and he said "wasnt us." that agent retired but helped recruit others. those may have retired and helped recruit others. Just that one connection in a file, "we asked agent $name and he said $agency knew nothing" might be justifiable to keep secret if theres a connection to someone still active.

> Hypothetical: They checked with an agent who is deep / high up in some foreign agency and he said "wasnt us." that agent retired but helped recruit others. those may have retired and helped recruit others.

> Just that one connection in a file, "we asked agent $name and he said $agency knew nothing" might be justifiable to keep secret if theres a connection to someone still active.

The names of the agents would be redacted at first place on declassified material.

Re: New JFK assassination revelation could upend the lone gunman theory

#133

Post by fullspectrumdev »

dcormier wrote: post #32
bluGill wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oswald was a marine sharpshooter, and it took him 3 shots with a scoped rifle (probably at point blank range, though I don't know the ballistics of that gun). That suggests it wasn't Oswald. Though even then Oswald clearly would have been standing next to the unknown shooter urging him to do it.

The shots were at 175, 240, and 270 feet[1]. It had a 4x scope[2]. [1] https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/h... [2] https://web.archive.org/web/20110724214814/http://www.aarcli...

In metric: 53.34m, 73.15m, 82.29m.

All sub-100 meter shots, easily achievable with a scoped rifle with 4x magnification and a bit of practice.

Re: New JFK assassination revelation could upend the lone gunman theory

#134

Post by dylan604 »

Apocryphon wrote: post #24
becquerel wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crazy that he chose to keep this secret for six decades. I wonder what possible reason he could have to bring it up now. Hmm, hmm, hmm.

Well, JFK’s nephew is running for president.

I thought maybe it had to do with all of the people believing JFK is coming back to Dallas

Re: New JFK assassination revelation could upend the lone gunman theory

#135

Post by indymike »

fsh wrote: post #69

The recollections of an 88 year old person about an event 60 years ago are simply not credible. He may truly remember picking up the bullet, but that doesn't mean it actually happened. Since he didn't mention it in his memos at the time, it probably didn't.

> The recollections of an 88 year old person about an event 60 years ago are simply not credible.

My experience with aging family members is that their memory of old events tends to improve as their short-term memory seems to get worse. I've had family memebers not remember where an object is, and from their nursing home bed, when asked about "what happened to ___?" reply with remarkable accuracy - to the point we were able to find several family heirlooms (photos from WWII that were lost in the 1960s, an old service rifle, old writings, paintings) right where they said it was. I wonder if perhaps that is the case here.

Re: New JFK assassination revelation could upend the lone gunman theory

#136

Post by whimsicalism »

jjoonathan wrote: post #120
xyzelement wrote: post #118

Not directly related to this article, but I found the lone gunman theory much easier to accept after visiting the museum in the former book depository in Dallas. You can look down onto the plaza from the exact spot Oswald shot from, and you can easily imagine how the bullet fired from there would go through JFK and into the governor sitting in front of him. Not that this proves anything, it was just a "oh, I can tang…

Similar: recent PR photos made it "click" for me that modern stealthy aircraft look exactly like "flying saucer" UFOs from the front. https://www.cnn.com/2022/12/02/politics/b-21-stealth-bomber-...

Everyone knows that modern stealth aircraft looks like that, but that is not what has been causing the recent furor.

Re: New JFK assassination revelation could upend the lone gunman theory

#137

Post by adolph »

bluGill wrote: post #93
knowingowl wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the record, a "marine sharpshooter" is an almost meaningless term. Virtually any physically healthy person is capable of meeting this bar with an hour or two of practice. It sounds way more impressive than it is. Oswald was in no way a highly skilled shooter. In fact, he had extremely basic firearms skills.

He won awards for marksmanship. I agree it isn't a hard skill to learn, but it's still takes some effort.

Seriously, one has to be a total bolo to not get an award for marksmanship. Everyone walks through the training and if orders are followed and one is not a total klutz, the award is Marksman "on a marksman/sharpshooter/expert scale."

During his Marine Corps service in December 1956, Oswald scored a rating of sharpshooter (twice achieving 48 and 49 out of 50 shots during rapid fire at a stationary target 200 yards [183 m] away using a standard issue M1 Garand semi-automatic rifle), although in May 1959, he qualified as a marksman (a lower classification than that of sharpshooter). [0]

0. https://en.wikipedia.org//wiki/John_F._Kennedy_assassination...

While he was at San Diego, Oswald was trained in the use of the M-1 rifle. His practice scores were not very good, but when his company fired for record on December 21, he scored 212, 2 points above the score necessary to qualify as a "sharpshooter" on a marksman/sharpshooter/expert scale. He did not do nearly as well when he fired for record again shortly before he left the Marines. He practiced also with a riot gun and a .45-caliber pistol when he was in the Marines but no scores were recorded. [1]

1. https://www.archives.gov/research/jfk/warren-commission-repo...

Re: New JFK assassination revelation could upend the lone gunman theory

#138

Post by thinkharderdev »

JohnBooty wrote: post #58
Trombone12 wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how does that upend anything? That it fell out already in the car does not seem dramatically different from it falling out after shaking Kennedy a bit.

According to the Warren Commission, the bullet was on Connally's stretcher and presumably fell out of Connally. So if true (not that we can really know at this point) if the pristine bullet was retrieved from Kennedy's car then yes, that would upend everything.

They were in the same car
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