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British F-35Bs to bring vertical landing abilities to highways

thedrive.com

131–140 of 332 posts

Re: British F-35Bs to bring vertical landing abilities to highways

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crucially this is also true in Ukraine. The Ukrainian Air Force has found a new clever way to keep using normal air bases. After a hangar got bombed by cruise/ballistic missiles they would print a 1:1 aerial/satellite picture of the rubble, hang it over the actual rubble and then clean up under the print. It took quite a few weeks for the Russians to understand this ruse. The doctrine of always having air superiority…

> After a hangar got bombed by cruise/ballistic missiles they would print a 1:1 aerial/satellite picture of the rubble, hang it over the actual rubble and then clean up under the print. It took quite a few weeks for the Russians to understand this ruse. This sounds very interesting! Any sources?

RUSI wrote about it, page 25 of this report:

https://rusi.org/explore-our-research/publications/special-r...

BTW, if you like reading longer reports on the technical/military aspects of this war then I can recommend RUSI. I haven't seen a better source so far. They release a report every now and then.

Re: British F-35Bs to bring vertical landing abilities to highways

#132
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is concrete used much in Europe? I’d think asphalt is a much more common highway surface material.

In the UK concrete has mainly been superseded by asphalt but there are one or two hold-outs. The M3 motorway (which heads from London down to Winchester / Southampton) has a long (ten miles?) concrete stretch which I drove along every day for years, although this is the exception that proves the rule. The road was noticeably more noisy / rumbly than others.

https://nationalhighways.co.uk/our-roads/concrete-roads/ 400 miles, apparently. But much less common outside of the east of england.

Concrete is also commonly used on heavy industrial estates - if they've got hundreds of 40 tonne lorries making sharp turns every day, they need the durability.

Re: British F-35Bs to bring vertical landing abilities to highways

#133
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It's expensive to ask people to risk their lives for work. Unless you're in the Russian army.

The Russians are paying good-for-Russia bonuses to attract recruits, as well as giving anyone who fights or builds for the military in Ukraine veteran status.

But will you survive to enjoy those beenfits?

Re: British F-35Bs to bring vertical landing abilities to highways

#134
post #53

Highway landing and take-off on its own is useless. F35 requires extensive machinery to maintain, in needs proper airport and hangars. It is not possible to operate it somewhere from forest! And vertical landing/takeoff can not support any load, it can not even be fully fuelled! In Czechia we are replacing Gripens that can operate from almost anywhere. It only needs a few hundred meters of road, and single truck to r…

It's vertical landing, not vertical take off. It's still a short rolling take off. I actually wouldn't be suprised to find they do a short rolling landing too (rather than go full hover, use the lift fan to allow them to land at lower than normal stall speed would be). They've tested the rolling landing on board the HMS QE And yes, for full maintenance, you do need need a proper airport and hangars. But for a quick r…

The Czechs are buying the conventional variant of the F-35, not the vertical landing variant.

Re: British F-35Bs to bring vertical landing abilities to highways

#135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right now that is not verifiable. It is a clasiffied information, only supported by claims from manufacturer. And maintaince cost is already dispuded at court in Switzerland. >It would be completely impractical to operate if you needed to completely overhaul it every flight. And? Maybe it is every 2nd or 10th flight, that does not make it much more practical. Cost for operating F35 is astronomical. Old Soviet airplan…

And their circle of hit probability with preprogrammed missiles is misured in hundreds meters instead of a handful. The war for which they were built never materialised, and their performances now largely obsolete. And who's going to sell you replacement parts anyway if your principal adversary is also your plane supplier? You want suppliers that don't threaten to nuke you every other week. Soviet planes came at a mu…

I get your point. But:

- right now we have fighters from Sweden (not Soviet design obviously)

- Soviet planes came with technical plans, we would be probably capable to fix them by our selves to huge extend. Ukraine maintained their Soviet planes for 10 years during war. Also we manufactured some airplanes ourself, and even today Czechia produces fighter jets.

- Many countries produces Soviet derived planes and spare parts. Ukraine, India, China.. Half of world operates those, and there is a huge market.

- For Slovakia (and other NATO countries) that operate Migs, Russia was actually supplying spare until very recently. They sabotaged spare parts AFTER it was announced that Migs were going to be send to Ukraine, which was against the support contract.

Re: British F-35Bs to bring vertical landing abilities to highways

#136
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"a wall of RF jamming" When using AI controlled I think the poster meant local AI controlled, no RF. We probably will also see laser communication from satellite to drones, which will be much more difficult to jam.

Having AI kill humans on their own without any supervision is an extremely controversial move. It will result in friendly fire sooner or later, and the resulting controversy is pretty much guaranteed to terminate the program. Laser comms are neat, but they suffer from things like clouds or smokescreens. And once you figure out the wavelength, a hostile laser comms sat can trivially jam it.

It's not that controversial in full blown war zones.

Air defense systems already have to operate autonomously for instance, since not every threat will be detected early enough to allow for human review.

Plus, friendly fire incidents also happen with humans, we don't punish those unless they're obviously negligent, just work on ways to not repeat that mistake, so how is AI any different?

The determination of negligence would just fall upon whoever was responsible for configuring the drone for that mission.

So, for example, if the drone was used to target a certain kind of tank which is in use on both sides and it was known ahead of time that the drone can't differentiate between them, it'd be negligent use, while a mission programmed with full understanding of the drone's capabilities results in friendly fire due to a previously unknown error, it'd be no different from any other current smart weapon messing up.

Re: British F-35Bs to bring vertical landing abilities to highways

#137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think what a lot of countries, like Germany (German here), for a lesson, is that your current stock of weapons is most useful in the beginning of a conflict as the conflict rapidly changes weapon development and your weapon will need heavy upgrades or they are no longer useful. All western weapons get less useful by the minute.

I don't see how you're reaching that conclusion from Ukraine. What Ukraine has shown is that war is mostly unchanged, you're still mostly just digging trenches and firing artillery at each other. Sure there are lots of drones, but that's mainly to make up for both side's lack of guided weapons and sufficient air power to establish air supremacy. Neither of which is an issue for NATO. The situation in Ukraine has only…

The Russians aren't risking their planes. They use cruise missiles and drones for behind the lines targets. I don't think the Russians lack guided weapons, they are launching dozens of cruise missiles each week. I think it's quite likely they're rationing their sophisticated weapons in case the conflict escalates.

From what I've seen, the drones have been very effective. A $10k drone taking out a $2M tank seems like a good trade, even if it takes 10 drones to do it.

It's fascinating to me to see how effective artillery is, you're right about that part. The territorial war is mostly about artillery, but the drones are a force multiplier there, assisting in removing enemy artillery as well as targeting.

Re: British F-35Bs to bring vertical landing abilities to highways

#138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what? So does the Dutch police. But that still doesn't mean you're about to ride your horses in quantity into war. Especially not as long as the opposition has (1) tanks and (2) operational machine guns.

I know. My comment was really a somewhat cynical view of the state of the UK's armoured vehicle capability. Our primary infantry fighting vehicle (Warrior) is about 40 years old now, and its upgrade programme has recently been canned after it proved impossible to fit modern turrets onto the antique hulls. But the cavalry regiments (who use tanks but ride horses ceremonially) would get very upset if the state of their…

I don't think the Warrior upgrade programme was cancelled due to it not working, just that the government wanted to save money.

Re: British F-35Bs to bring vertical landing abilities to highways

#140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> After a hangar got bombed by cruise/ballistic missiles they would print a 1:1 aerial/satellite picture of the rubble, hang it over the actual rubble and then clean up under the print. It took quite a few weeks for the Russians to understand this ruse. This sounds very interesting! Any sources?

RUSI wrote about it, page 25 of this report: https://rusi.org/explore-our-research/publications/special-r... BTW, if you like reading longer reports on the technical/military aspects of this war then I can recommend RUSI. I haven't seen a better source so far. They release a report every now and then.

Relevant quote from the report (the entire report seems extremely worth reading):

A critical weakness of the Russian strike campaign was battle damage assessment. First, the Russian military appears to have presumed that if an action had been ordered and carried out then it had succeeded, unless there was direct evidence to the contrary. Evidence of success appears to have disproportionately relied on three data points: confirmation from pilots that they hit their target; confirmation from Russian satellites that a site showed damage; and confirmation from signals intelligence (SIGINT) that Ukrainians reported a strike and damage to their equipment. Russian satellite reconnaissance proved very limited, even though Russian survey space reconnaissance of Ukraine has been conducted since at least 2012, and detailed reconnaissance, in the interests of invasion planning, since mid-2021. A probable reason for this may be the insufficient number of satellites in the orbital grouping of the VKS and the overestimation of their technical capabilities. Indirect confirmation of this explanation is provided by the fact that the AFRF began buying additional satellite images of the territory of Ukraine and individual military facilities on the world market in April 2022. One of the visible failures of satellite intelligence is the inability to detect on time a significant volume of strategic railway movements by the UAF, which, in March 2022 amounted to three–four echelons per day.

The poor Russian battle damage assessment process made the Russian military highly vulnerable to deception, which has been consistent throughout the conflict. Early strikes on Ukrainian airfields, for example, destroyed many hangars. By photographing this damage and printing the resulting pattern on to sheets, it became possible to clear the rubble and erect covers for aircraft to return to the site, sheltering in positions that the Russians would confirm as destroyed. This led – somewhat amusingly – to the Russians debating whether Ukrainian fighter aircraft were operating from subterranean shelters at several sites. Repeated strikes on dummy air-defence positions also saw a considerable wastage of ammunition, while Ukrainian troops could confirm that sites were destroyed over the radio even when they were still functioning, causing Russian aircraft to ignore air-defence systems in their mission planning. The already-publicly reported use of dummy HIMARS (high mobility artillery rocket system) later in the war to lure Russian fires is indicative of the systematic use of deception to ensure survivability by the UAF, and it has proven widely effective.

The presumption of success caused the Russian military to take several unjustifiable risks in the disposition of its forces during the first 72 hours of the conflict. Aircraft did not fly with EW pods during the opening phase as they were not deemed necessary following the presumed success of the strike campaign. Similarly, Russian manoeuvre forces were not properly supported by air-defence units and Russian air-defence units were told to presume that aircraft were friendly. This enabled a significant number of ground-attack sorties by the Ukrainian Air Force, including using UAVs such as TB2, against Russian formations, even when they had attached air-defence units. Ukraine suffered aircraft losses in air-to-air engagements, however.

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