Live data from Hacker News

Half of US wetlands lost federal protection. Their fate is up to the states

pilotonline.com

131–140 of 149 posts

Re: Half of US wetlands lost federal protection. Their fate is up to the states

#131
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Our laws are supposed to be interpreted via precedent. We are not a fly by night French civil system. Our legal traditions are rooted in maintaining centuries of stability within the law, altering those interpretations only in accordance with new laws. If the courts cannot be expected to consistently interpret the law, how can citizens be sure what that law means? To turn over fifty years of precedent on a whim is ce…

I’m curious then if you also oppose Brown and Obergefell?

This seems to be a sort of "gotcha" question, wherein you pose points of precedent breaking for which I am likely to support the outcome but not the process.

And you are right.

I absolutely support both same-sex marriage and the casting out of the vile separate-but-equal doctrine.

And I think both would have been better done as legislation.

When the supreme court struck down 50 years of precedent supporting the right of women to use abortion as a tool in reasonably controlling whether they would choose to go through the dangers of pregnancy, they showed precedent alone is not a dependable bulwark for the rights of the citizenry.

I also admit I find it far more reasonable for the courts to expand rights and protections than I do seeing it strip them away.

You might argue this is an expansion of rights for those that would prefer to be unhindered by regulatory oversight while destroying, polluting and mismanaging the wetlands now under their control, and I suppose it is. Though I doubt any good will come of it.

Re: Half of US wetlands lost federal protection. Their fate is up to the states

#132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You use the term "This radicalized illegitimate SCOTUS" but you realize that the court was unanimous that the EPA had overstepped its authority under the law right?

There was most certainly not unanimity on the redefinition of wetlands, which is what they were talking about.

> While the nine justices agreed that the Sacketts should prevail, they divided 5-to-4 as to how far to go in limiting the EPA's authority.

https://www.npr.org/2023/05/25/1178150234/supreme-court-epa-...

Re: Half of US wetlands lost federal protection. Their fate is up to the states

#133
post #129
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reminds me of how a court declared that San Diego's overgrown drainage system was a protected wetland and they had to offset it in order to dredge it out and keep a century flood from happening.

And on the other side, farmer suing the German government because of climate change, while she is plowing wetlands... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21407836 In fact, here's video of her plowing wetlands, https://www.reuters.com/business/environment/its-my-home-isl... She won her politically correct case BTW https://www.reuters.com/business/environment/its-my-home-isl... Hopefully Germany outlaws her existence…

> Hopefully Germany outlaws her existence

Welp.

Re: Half of US wetlands lost federal protection. Their fate is up to the states

#134
post #129
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reminds me of how a court declared that San Diego's overgrown drainage system was a protected wetland and they had to offset it in order to dredge it out and keep a century flood from happening.

And on the other side, farmer suing the German government because of climate change, while she is plowing wetlands... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21407836 In fact, here's video of her plowing wetlands, https://www.reuters.com/business/environment/its-my-home-isl... She won her politically correct case BTW https://www.reuters.com/business/environment/its-my-home-isl... Hopefully Germany outlaws her existence…

And let’s not even start on how much wetland the Dutch have destroyed with their dykes.

Re: Half of US wetlands lost federal protection. Their fate is up to the states

#135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which makes sense because water flows underground.

It also makes it impossible for someone to decide ex ante if their property is a wetland, a problem with the current process SCOTUS called out. Namely, the government wouldn’t tell you if your property was a wetland until after it thought you’d violated the law.

[deleted]

Re: Half of US wetlands lost federal protection. Their fate is up to the states

#136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have a script dude. You seem to have this same comment on almost every thread that has anything to do with law.

Well, it's not automated. But we must all remember that as software engineers we are not trained in the law and so, before we argue for US wetlands to receive federal protection, we should first let the experts, who have experience, training, and credentials decide. Land use is a complex and nuanced subject and before you argue for one way or the other, perhaps you should listen to the experts. Remember, people can d…

Ya but it doesn't seem particularly useful or insightful when you are commenting this on every single post that comes up every single time. Like seriously you've been doing this for weeks.

Re: Half of US wetlands lost federal protection. Their fate is up to the states

#137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Congress basically has all the power. They could just tell SCOTUS to piss off. Maybe that's why so many people are happy to see the gridlock and dysfunction. Heaven help us if too many congresspeople really agree on something.

> Congress basically has all the power. They could just tell SCOTUS to piss off. No? If SCOTUS says a law is unconstitutional, you’re either in amendment territory, or the complete collapse of the American system if Congress and the Executive ignore them.

Who gave SCOTUS the power of judicial review? SCOTUS did. Not the Constitution. In fact, the Constitution grants Congress wide ranging power over the court. The idea that the three branches are co-equal is a popular myth. Congress definitely has more power than either the executive or the judicial branch. Which of course is exactly what you'd expect given that the power of the people is manifested primarily through the legislature.

If Congress wants, they can write legislation and then simultaneously exclude it from judicial review.

Re: Half of US wetlands lost federal protection. Their fate is up to the states

#138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Congress basically has all the power. They could just tell SCOTUS to piss off. No? If SCOTUS says a law is unconstitutional, you’re either in amendment territory, or the complete collapse of the American system if Congress and the Executive ignore them.

Who gave SCOTUS the power of judicial review? SCOTUS did. Not the Constitution. In fact, the Constitution grants Congress wide ranging power over the court. The idea that the three branches are co-equal is a popular myth. Congress definitely has more power than either the executive or the judicial branch. Which of course is exactly what you'd expect given that the power of the people is manifested primarily through t…

The Constitution is meaningless in that scenario. The Founding Fathers weren’t that dumb.

Re: Half of US wetlands lost federal protection. Their fate is up to the states

#139
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Our laws are supposed to be interpreted via precedent. We are not a fly by night French civil system. Our legal traditions are rooted in maintaining centuries of stability within the law, altering those interpretations only in accordance with new laws. If the courts cannot be expected to consistently interpret the law, how can citizens be sure what that law means? To turn over fifty years of precedent on a whim is ce…

I’m curious then if you also oppose Brown and Obergefell?

[deleted]

Re: Half of US wetlands lost federal protection. Their fate is up to the states

#140
post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m curious then if you also oppose Brown and Obergefell?

This seems to be a sort of "gotcha" question, wherein you pose points of precedent breaking for which I am likely to support the outcome but not the process. And you are right. I absolutely support both same-sex marriage and the casting out of the vile separate-but-equal doctrine. And I think both would have been better done as legislation. When the supreme court struck down 50 years of precedent supporting the right…

[deleted]
Post reply on HN