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Subreddit Migration Directory

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Re: Subreddit Migration Directory

#131

Post by Vvector »

jakecopp wrote: post #49
unclekev wrote: post #19

Just went to the 'Programming' lemmy/beehaw and the first thing I see is a post about how they have had to defederate from some instances because of a lack of proper mod tools, trolls and bad actors. The irony. > https://beehaw.org/post/567170 > these two instances’ open registration policy, which is extremely problematic for us given how federation works and how trivial it makes trolling, harassment, and other undes…

That's a feature, not a bug. Moderation in the fediverse (inc. Mastodon & Lemmy) means defederating from "problematic" instances, where problematic is defined in the rules of the server doing the federating server (which appears to be documented at https://beehaw.org/instances ) This means moderation happens at a community & instance level rather than global moderation. Please correct me if I'm missing something - I'…

But we were told "You can access all content in the lemmyverse from any server/instance" (1). If lemmyworld is a "problematic" instance, why is it one of the recommended sites to join? Seems like the messaging is confusing for new users.

(1) https://join-lemmy.org/instances

Re: Subreddit Migration Directory

#132

Post by shaky-carrousel »

Vvector wrote: post #131
jakecopp wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a feature, not a bug. Moderation in the fediverse (inc. Mastodon & Lemmy) means defederating from "problematic" instances, where problematic is defined in the rules of the server doing the federating server (which appears to be documented at https://beehaw.org/instances ) This means moderation happens at a community & instance level rather than global moderation. Please correct me if I'm missing something - I'…

But we were told "You can access all content in the lemmyverse from any server/instance" (1). If lemmyworld is a "problematic" instance, why is it one of the recommended sites to join? Seems like the messaging is confusing for new users. (1) https://join-lemmy.org/instances

Yeah, I created an account in lemmyworld simply because it was the first one in the list, and this move from beehaw pisses me infinitely. So now I do have to trash all the work I did subscribing because they threw a tantrum?

Well, they can have their server to themselves, I'm not going to subscribe to another server only to see it also blocked. They have proven to be the unreliable ones.

I hope the rest of the network retaliates and defederate beehaw. That's the right thing to do. If they want to be alone, grant their wishes and make them alone.

Re: Subreddit Migration Directory

#133

Post by bbotond »

unclekev wrote: post #19

Just went to the 'Programming' lemmy/beehaw and the first thing I see is a post about how they have had to defederate from some instances because of a lack of proper mod tools, trolls and bad actors. The irony. > https://beehaw.org/post/567170 > these two instances’ open registration policy, which is extremely problematic for us given how federation works and how trivial it makes trolling, harassment, and other undes…

Join the programming.dev instance instead. It’s really nice and starting to become an active community.

Re: Subreddit Migration Directory

#135

Post by mvdtnz »

Personally I'd prefer a subreddit to subreddit mapping. /r/newzealand is refusing to let you read or post? Go to /r/aotearoa. Can't talk about F1 in /r/formula1? Check out /r/f1 etc.

I'm not interested in Lemmy or Mastodon or any of this stuff.

Re: Subreddit Migration Directory

#136

Post by ubertaco »

malermeister wrote: post #63
none_to_remain wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think many people implicitly desire that the federation graph is complete, or practically nearly-complete with some pariah servers cut off. To put it differently, they want to be "user@host" in a system with a global namespace, not "user" in the "host" namespace with patchy access to others.

The problem is that a complete graph doesn't really make sense because people are different and find different things acceptable. I don't want Nazi shit on my reddit replacement. I'm assuming a lot of people here wouldn't want theirs to be full of commie shit. Then there's the religious nuts etc etc. Think of it less as censorship and more as community self-segregation. I wouldn't go to a Nazi bar or Sunday school in…

>Think of it less as censorship and more as community self-segregation. I wouldn't go to a Nazi bar or Sunday school in real life, why would I want to be in the online equivalent?

A closer analogy here is that your city councilman doesn't want to go to a Nazi bar or Sunday school in real life, and so he orders all the roads to the churches and the bars demolished, and also the roads to all the houses of the people who go to the churches or Nazi bars.

"After all," he says, "they can still build their own network of roads if they want. We're just not going to allow anyone in our community to use our network of roads to get there."

Re: Subreddit Migration Directory

#137

Post by Vvector »

shaky-carrousel wrote: post #132
Vvector wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But we were told "You can access all content in the lemmyverse from any server/instance" (1). If lemmyworld is a "problematic" instance, why is it one of the recommended sites to join? Seems like the messaging is confusing for new users. (1) https://join-lemmy.org/instances

Yeah, I created an account in lemmyworld simply because it was the first one in the list, and this move from beehaw pisses me infinitely. So now I do have to trash all the work I did subscribing because they threw a tantrum? Well, they can have their server to themselves, I'm not going to subscribe to another server only to see it also blocked. They have proven to be the unreliable ones. I hope the rest of the networ…

Defederation wars is not the solution. There needs to be finer grained tools. But I don't have any good answers.

Re: Subreddit Migration Directory

#138

Post by malermeister »

ubertaco wrote: post #136
malermeister wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that a complete graph doesn't really make sense because people are different and find different things acceptable. I don't want Nazi shit on my reddit replacement. I'm assuming a lot of people here wouldn't want theirs to be full of commie shit. Then there's the religious nuts etc etc. Think of it less as censorship and more as community self-segregation. I wouldn't go to a Nazi bar or Sunday school in…

>Think of it less as censorship and more as community self-segregation. I wouldn't go to a Nazi bar or Sunday school in real life, why would I want to be in the online equivalent? A closer analogy here is that your city councilman doesn't want to go to a Nazi bar or Sunday school in real life, and so he orders all the roads to the churches and the bars demolished, and also the roads to all the houses of the people wh…

Let me answer with a somewhat famous reddit post (ironic, huh?): https://old.reddit.com/r/TalesFromYourServer/comments/hsiisw...

If you don't kick Nazis out of your bar, they will infiltrate it, run everyone who isn't a Nazi out and then you're running a Nazi bar yourself.

Re: Subreddit Migration Directory

#139

Post by p-e-w »

fzeroracer wrote: post #96
p-e-w wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The fediverse is just random scattered kingdoms having fragile connections. Indeed. And each "kingdom" has the exact same problem with power centralization that the Fediverse supposedly solves. And the more popular an instance becomes, the bigger this problem gets. And the more popular an instance becomes, the more people will join it. And boom, we're back to zero.

Neither of you seem to get it. You're talking about 'power centralization' in a completely different and orthogonal way from how the federation works, which makes me think you have a fundamental misunderstanding of centralization or federation. If you're banned from a popular instance you're not banned from the platform as a whole. Because there is no single authority dictating where you can and cannot post, unlike R…

> If you're banned from a popular instance you're not banned from the platform as a whole.

The most popular instances are the platform. Yes, you can run your own instance, with only yourself as a user. Unless others choose to federate with you, that's the equivalent of calling your blog a social network. And if the biggest instances impose their own rules on others under threat of severing federation, the freedom to run your instance as you wish exists only in theory.

Re: Subreddit Migration Directory

#140

Post by junon »

mvdtnz wrote: post #135

Personally I'd prefer a subreddit to subreddit mapping. /r/newzealand is refusing to let you read or post? Go to /r/aotearoa. Can't talk about F1 in /r/formula1? Check out /r/f1 etc. I'm not interested in Lemmy or Mastodon or any of this stuff.

Then you've missed the entire point of "migrating".
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