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Framework Laptop 16

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Re: Framework Laptop 16

#131

Post by vidarh »

justeleblanc wrote: post #76
speed_spread wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Niche? One for the keyboard, one for the mouse. That's a normal computer, if you believe wires are better than Bluetooth.

We're talking about a laptop. What's the point of a laptop if you're just going to make it into an underpowered desktop? And it's not like mouses and keyboards need a 4Gbps connection to the host. Plug them into a tiny hub. You're already lugging a keyboard and mouse around, why not a hub too?

My laptop is "an underpowered desktop" 90% of the time, but it saves me from having a second machine the remaining part of the time.

But I agree regarding ports - at home my mouse and keyboard are plugged into a cheap KVM switch, so I still need only one USB port on the laptop; If I needed to lug them with me I'd certainly just bring a hub too.

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#132

Post by echelon »

hkt wrote: post #105
codedokode wrote: post #103

Finally, a proper screen size instead of toy-level 13 inches. You cannot code on a 13-inch display (unless you have eagle's eyes and use tiny font) and it feels like the only use for 13-inch laptop is to watch videos and photos on social network sites while sitting in a cafe which makes it a toy, not a real laptop for work (but Apple seems to be selling such toy laptops successfully). By the way the current trend is…

> You cannot code on a 13-inch display When I was young and poor, I used to code on an Asus EeePC with a 9" screen and half sized keyboard. It wasn't ideal but actually, it was fine.

I put Linux on a Sony Vaio P and did homework and Python coding on it.

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#133

Post by nicoburns »

ochoseis wrote: post #122
savef wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ha, that's an interesting take. My Dell work laptop has these (not full-sized) and I don't like them at all. There's nothing fun about trying to use the arrows and accidentally slipping onto a key that isn't usually there, which might scroll my cursor/window by a huge amount. My fingers expect no space there, so it makes the whole area less distinct to touch to have the spaces filled.

On my OS you can use CTRL+PgUp/PgDown to cycle through tabs, which makes the dedicated keys by the arrows really useful for single-handed tab cycling. Most other ways require a chord with both hands, so it’s just a lot slower.

Ctrl-tab can be pressed with one hand, no?

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#134

Post by vidarh »

delta_p_delta_x wrote: post #67

At a notebook-specific forum I frequent[1], a user has noticed that the Framework 16 modular discrete graphics solution uses a connector first used by Dell in its Precision 7530 and 7730 workstation notebooks, released in 2018. The connector is called 'Dell Graphics Form Factor' (DGFF), and is the array of gold LGA pads on the motherboard seen in the bottom-right screenshot in a photo, at the above link. Dell has bee…

If I could get a hefty one to use at home, and be able to do without on the rare occasions I take my laptop out of the house, it'd be a strong incentive to get one of these. I've been pondering going back to using a desktop at home since my laptop is docked most of the time and it'd be nice to have a GPU that's unreasonably power-hungry for a laptop, but I really like not having to have two separate machines.

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#135

Post by nicoburns »

cduzz wrote: post #80
Leimi wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sadly I feel like trackpoints are really end of life and I wouldn't be surprised if Lenovo ditched them entirely soon. It seems they keep it only to please the tiny but vocal minority of tinkerers that we are. But we mostly buy old, second hand thinkpads. And as keyboards get thinner, trackpoints lose in quality. On linux it seems the software side is also not as good as before with libinput. So I'd be really surpris…

There's a trope in car nerd circles of "We all know the best vehicle is a manual transmission brown diesel station wagon" and then of course these people only buy one that's 10 years old, so at this point no car company makes such a beast new . Pre-covid I'd made do with whatever garbage keyboard and garbage monitor $job dumped in front of me, but almost by happenstance I ended up with a 16:10 monitor and an IBM M4-1…

Apparently the reason nobody makes station wagons new (for the US market) is because the US has a tax on cars and there is a loophole that allows SUVs and pickup trucks to avoids it as they are classified as "light trucks". There are plenty of station wagons made for the european market (although we call them estate cars on this side of the pond).

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#137

Post by chuankl »

apetrovic wrote: post #128
panick21_ wrote: post #104

One of my favorite things for keyboards is the ThinkPad feature where the Page Up and Page Down is above the Left and Right key. I don't understand why others don't do this, its so practical. Specially in cases like this, there is just an empty space there. Why not put 2 more keys? ThinkPad also makes them full sized keys, that would be even better. But just having empty space? Why?

Because it's easier to touch empty space and adjust fingers. Back when I worked on Thinkpad, I really hated these keys, whenever I accidentally pressed them. I don't say you're wrong, just it's a matter of taste. It's the same with mechanical keyboards - I can't use these compact 75% keyboards where arrows/Pg Up/Pg Down/Home/End are flush with other keys; but a bit "exploded" layout, with just a bit of space between…

IIRC on ThinkPad keyboards, the 6-key navigation block (arrow keys + pgup & pgdn) has a lower baseline -- the bottom of the block is lower than the bottom of the rest of the keys on the keyboard. So it is still easy to find the arrow keys by touch, even without blank space above the left and the right arrow keys.

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#138

Post by giancarlostoro »

nicoburns wrote: post #133
ochoseis wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On my OS you can use CTRL+PgUp/PgDown to cycle through tabs, which makes the dedicated keys by the arrows really useful for single-handed tab cycling. Most other ways require a chord with both hands, so it’s just a lot slower.

Ctrl-tab can be pressed with one hand, no?

And Ctrl+shift+tab with the same exact hand to go the opposite direction.

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#139

Post by chrismorgan »

codedokode wrote: post #113
Aachen wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ugh. After over a decade of work, everything was finally adapted to or made for 16:9, now they're going after hipster ratios? Not a deal breaker but a bummer. Interesting that phones are going the other way, so now we can enjoy letterboxes on both platforms and not be able to reach the notification drawer. What was so wrong with 16:9 that we needed another competing standard that's just slightly off...

What 16:9 is good for? It is inconvenient for any work: for coding, reading articles or working with documents more height is better. Please explain for what kind of activity wide, but low height screen is the most suitable? The only thing that comes to mind is killing time by watching videos on social networks sites.

I tile windows side-by-side.

I split Vim side-by-side.

I use Tree Style Tab in Firefox and hide the horizontal tab bar. (If I’m tiling a browser beside something else, I close the tab sidebar most of the time.)

16:9 is fine, so long as you’re set up to be able to use that width.

On my 13.5″ Surface Book, I appreciated its 3:2 aspect ratio, because it was already too narrow to comfortably tile things horizontally anyway, so why not go even more in the tall direction?

On my current 15.6″ 16:9 laptop, I tile and split frequently because it’s comfortable. 16:10 would still be fine, but I do this enough that I believe I’d honestly very slightly prefer 16:9 for its extra centimetre of width (~5 columns in my terminal), even at the cost of 1.5cm of height (~2 rows).

There are advantages and disadvantages to the different ratios in different scenarios.

(Still, I do think that most people would find 16:10 a happier medium at this size. But me, I can effectively use 16:9, though I don’t think I’d want to go any wider.)

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#140

Post by echelon »

5mv2 wrote: post #5
hoppyhoppy2 wrote: post #2

Related discussion from yesterday: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35277660

This thread is a goldmine! 390 comments, and many from current users. Thank you for sharing.

One of my least favorite things about the Framework 13 was the low midrange feel of the system. The customization experience is top notch, but the computing itself was underwhelming. This new entry should fix that problem.

I'll probably pick one up.

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