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Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

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Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#131
post #18

I can only imagine how hard it is to have fair negotiations when a prospective employee applies at a competing company only to be told "no thanks" simply because of a hush hush agreement between the executives of said companies. This flies counter with Google's "do no evil" statement and certainly doesn't paint a positive posthumous picture of Jobs.

I'm tired of people bringing up 'don't do evil' EVERY time Google does something they dislike. New search results using personal targeting - EVIL! Anti-poaching agreement with Apple - EVIL! Closed down a bagel cafe next to my cubicle - EVIL! Can we all agree that the word Evil has a more sinister use - ie knowing endangering lives, environmental damage, maybe closing press freedoms? And, therefore, we should be more…

(Disclaimer: Google employee, speaking for myself, not the company.)

The point of "Don't be evil" is to hold ourselves to a higher standard, and not less us take the easy way out. That, IMHO, is what made Google great in the first place.

I'm not going to comment on the specific case here - I don't know the facts - but the reason for "Don't be evil" is as much motivational as moral.

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#133
I think this Betabeat article is really relevant since it shows that this is happening at the startup level in NYC as well:

http://www.betabeat.com/2011/11/17/poaching-etiquette-how-to...

This is important because it means that new hires are probably getting less equity than they should be getting. Equity and belief in what the company is building should be enough to not require anti-poaching agreements.

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#134
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it amusing when well-meaning people try to dictate what a given word or phrase should mean. Language evolves in a chaotic way, often against logical arguments. You might be right, but "conspiracy theory" already has an established meaning, and you are not going to change that.

Sure, but that also means I am free to try and re-re-define words back to their origin as well :)

Indeed, you are free to. On occasion I've tried to do the same thing. But in practice, I don't think it usually helps. It muddies up the waters of conversation, which depend on everyone having roughly the same definitions of words. At least, you have to be careful, and know that most people won't (immediately) change, and that you're making things more complicated.

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In what way does poaching create artificial demand? If your employee is valuable enough that another company wants to recruit them, that's not artificial demand, it's real demand. If you won't or can't match a salary somebody else is willing to pay, you deserve to lose that employee. If your employee can't do the tasks you require of him, you fire him. If you can't pay your employees what they are worth, they go else…

Lets take a scenario. You Hire a guy and pay him $120 K a year. Within 6 months you spend say $60k training him. He now theoretically becomes worth $120K per year. Would you be happy if someone just came and offered that much? Considering the time taken to recruit and money to train him. In essence, Facebook (or big spenders) can make a small talented startup their official recruiting arm. As the guy being recruited,…

you hire a guy and spend 60k training him, he probably feels some loyalty to you. maybe he doesn't, maybe he goes somewhere else, this is one of the risks you as an entrepreneur must take. creating a culture of loyalty is a way to lessen this risk. attempting to sabotage your employees options is not an acceptable solution, either legally or morally.

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#136
I'm surprised just how ruthlessly this was enforced. When Jobs complained to Schmidt, the person who contacted an Apple employee was "terminated within the hour." A Senior Google VP replied: "Appropriate response, thank you. Please make a public example of this termination with the group."

Mind you, they have a great incentive. Only a handful of companies recognise 10x (or 100x) developers and they would like to continue paying just 2x for them.

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#137

I think anyone whose opinion of Steve Jobs is changed by this knowledge needs to take a good look in the mirror and ask if they are not the hypocrite. Jobs always was a consumate businessman. Before Apple, even, he was scheming his way through a job, getting Wozniak to do his work and going back on his word to split profits. But isn't that what America is all about? Aren't your shoes, clothes, electronics, etc. made…

Wait, what? Are you seriously saying that it is ok b/c of what got created?

I can't really fathom that is what you are saying. Personally, I've never bought into Jobs' cargo cult following. I've always thought the dude was a bit shifty and, frankly, an asshole. I hope history remembers him that way instead of saying "everything was ok because of the ipod". So, I guess I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt that you are NOT saying Jobs is a good guy and everything is ok...but if you are, shame on you.

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#138

According to http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/921674/In_Re_High-Tech_Emp... , the source pdf, defendants are: * Apple * Lucasfilm * Adobe * Intuit * Google * Intel * Pixar Good to know. I shall follow this case with interest.

I'm curious if the list is exhaustive, or if it is just the ones who got caught.

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#139

"Please make a public example of this termination with the group." Yikes. Sounds positively medieval.

That quote stood out for me as well. I now have an association with "Shona Brown" and evil sociopath. What a sick woman.
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