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Stripe increases fees for EU and UK-based businesses in April

support.stripe.com

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Re: Stripe increases fees for EU and UK-based businesses in April

#131
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can a user dispute a transaction if they used 3DSecure?

A dispute is not only for transactions you didn't perform, it is also for situations like not getting the purchased product or similar. So 3DSecure will significantly decrease fraud, not other disputes.

But fraud are the problematic ones, the normal disputes are not as costly

Re: Stripe increases fees for EU and UK-based businesses in April

#132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Traders in the EU are not allowed to charge you extra for using your credit or debit card. https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/consumers/shopping/pri...

Interesting. So foreign cards have to be accepted at the same price? I know credit card fees are capped in EU, so this might be a reasonable policy, but if merchants and domestic customers have to eat costs due to foreign card costs via higher prices for everyone, that does not seem fair.

> So foreign cards have to be accepted at the same price?

No, only regulated cards have to be accepted at that price.

So a surcharge can be charged for EU commercial cards which also cost > 2% and are not subject to the interchange regulation.

Re: Stripe increases fees for EU and UK-based businesses in April

#133
post #7

"Businesses in the EEA who are paying out in USD to a US-domiciled bank account will now incur a 1% fee, with a minimum fee of US$2.50 per payout." This is absurd. A 1% fee to transfer USD to a USD bank account? The alternative is to charge in another currency - which Stripe will put a 2% currency fee on. This is already on top of their expensive transaction costs. Will actively look for alternatives now.

PayPal does the same... For non-us citizens, USD's either incur a conversation fee to another currency, or an international withdrawal fee. There is no way to get money out without paying one or other fee.

Took me years to find out how they're scamming me on the conversion charges/exchange rate.

Say you want to buy product in USD, and you come from non-USA country. Paypal would "helpfully" convert USD to your local currency using their own exchange rate (worse than any other one - goes without saying), charge the linked bank account (which probably is in USD anyway, to avoid paying for conversion fees), then the local bank would charge you again by converting the payment from the local currency to say USD because the account is in USD. Those practices probably cost me thousands over the years until I've figured out what was happening.

I've turned on the option (intentionally buried and difficult to find) that tells Paypal to charge me in the currency I've was purchasing (USD), and not to do the conversion. But the fuckers had a habit of flipping that option so you're caught off guard. Needless to say, been Paypal-free for years now. One can imagine how much Paypal and banks profit from this scammy/dark-pattern behaviour on a global scale.

Re: Stripe increases fees for EU and UK-based businesses in April

#134
This ain't as bad as international PayPal... We (EU company) have clients paying from abroad via PayPal. I can't figure out what to do with this. We're being hit with 4.7% PayPal international fee, then ~ 3.75% fee to convert USD to our local currency to withdraw to our bank account. (PayPal won't let us withdraw USD.) Then another 2-3% to convert it back to USD in our bank to pay our supplier in USD. Imagine the total.

And the number of our PayPal-paying customers keeps growing. For some mysterious reasons it is convenient for people in very remote parts of the world to use PayPal. Direct credit card payment gateway and wire transfers are significantly more difficult for them.

Re: Stripe increases fees for EU and UK-based businesses in April

#135
post #51

Some European alternatives you might be able to find/negotiate better fees with: - mollie (Netherlands) - adyen (Netherlands) - Klarna (Sweden) - Paylike (Denmark) - Mangopay (Luxembourg) - Quickpay (Denmark) (added in edit) The ones I've tried of those, have an OK development experience, maybe not as polished as Stripe, but much better than the alternatives that were around before Stripe (huge hassle back then). Ide…

>This strikes me as weird. User buys something from me, regrets it and issues a chargeback, dispute gets started and bank says I did nothing wrong, so the charge still sticks, but Stripe gets to keep the fee for handling the dispute? You should include this in your contract terms with the customer and collect the dispute fee from them. It's not reasonable of you to expect Stripe to just absorb this cost.

Yeah that is not even remotely legal in any country with decent consumer protection.

Re: Stripe increases fees for EU and UK-based businesses in April

#136

Some European alternatives you might be able to find/negotiate better fees with: - mollie (Netherlands) - adyen (Netherlands) - Klarna (Sweden) - Paylike (Denmark) - Mangopay (Luxembourg) - Quickpay (Denmark) (added in edit) The ones I've tried of those, have an OK development experience, maybe not as polished as Stripe, but much better than the alternatives that were around before Stripe (huge hassle back then). Ide…

Adyen is relatively solid if you know what you're doing, Mangopay felt like a small hippie solution in comparison. The upside is Mangopay was pretty reactive when we needed a human to talk to, the downside being that many requests would just end in "tough luck, we're too smal for that" We ended up moving to Adyen for that reason.

Can you share some details on the hippies and too small situations with Mangopay?

Re: Stripe increases fees for EU and UK-based businesses in April

#138

Some European alternatives you might be able to find/negotiate better fees with: - mollie (Netherlands) - adyen (Netherlands) - Klarna (Sweden) - Paylike (Denmark) - Mangopay (Luxembourg) - Quickpay (Denmark) (added in edit) The ones I've tried of those, have an OK development experience, maybe not as polished as Stripe, but much better than the alternatives that were around before Stripe (huge hassle back then). Ide…

For Poland, Przelewy24 or direct BLIK integration might be an option.

Re: Stripe increases fees for EU and UK-based businesses in April

#139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> SEPA in EU is already something but it is taking ages for it to become an actual payment platform in everyday's life. Is there anything stopping merchants from offering different prices to people based on different payment methods? I assume the reason merchants do not list a discount for paying via SEPA or ACH or debit card or whatever local non credit card (and non Visa/Amex/MC) option, is because merchants benefi…

I think this indirectly happens. I live in Haarlem, Netherlands, and some popular supermarkets in my area would not accept a VISA/Mastercard. They only accept Maestro(Which I think is cheaper for them because it is a debit card that Dutch banks give out). I found it surprising because that should mean they lose out on some business from so many expats that visit/live in Netherlands, but apparently not.

Maestro and Mastercard Debit cost more or less the same for NL-issued cards, interchange is a fixed 2ct [1]. As Mastercard is getting rid of Maestro, Dutch banks will start issuing Debit Mastercards soon.

Probably the supermarkets will switch to only accept Mastercard Debit/Visa Debit.

[1]: https://www.mastercard.com/content/dam/public/mastercardcom/...

Re: Stripe increases fees for EU and UK-based businesses in April

#140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A dispute is not only for transactions you didn't perform, it is also for situations like not getting the purchased product or similar. So 3DSecure will significantly decrease fraud, not other disputes.

But fraud are the problematic ones, the normal disputes are not as costly

My experience is that disputes are 100% from Americans who are encouraged by banks to "just do a dispute" anytime they are dissatisfied with anything. And in 100% of these cases it is customers who forgot to cancel or just didn't need the service as much, not really any actual dissatisfaction. Most fraud is stopped by Stripe and not really a big issue, in some cases we do a manual check and it is obvious fraud (no account activity, info not matching, fake data entry etc) and we just refund the charge before any dispute is made.
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