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How did Roomba-recorded photos end up on Facebook?

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Re: How did Roomba-recorded photos end up on Facebook?

#131

Post by Sirened »

1vuio0pswjnm7 wrote: post #126
andrewxdiamond wrote: post #4

Key paragraph for our friends who don’t RTFA > iRobot … confirmed that these images were captured by its Roombas in 2020. All of them came from “special development robots with hardware and software modifications that are not and never were present on iRobot consumer products for purchase,” the company said in a statement. They were given to “paid collectors and employees” who signed written agreements acknowledging…

"Seems like the real story is that training data was leaked, rather than the attention getting "they're watching you" narrative the title suggests" Was the HN title changed. I am having trouble seeing how one who did not read the article would interpret the HN title to suggest a "they're watching you" narrative. For example, one could interpret it as posing a question about leaked photos, e.g., who leaked them and/or…

Do you truly believe someone would see the headline "How did Roomba-recorded photos end up on Facebook?" and not ask themselves "wait...is MY Roomba recording photos that might end up on Facebook???". This is clearly clickbait-y, the question is intentionally vague to encourage people to read more. A less clickbaity and more clear question would be "how did photos from research Roombas end up on Facebook?" but that's spoiling the story's punchline, now isn't it.

Re: How did Roomba-recorded photos end up on Facebook?

#132

Post by Sirened »

quantified wrote: post #48
kelnos wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty sure none of the users consented to photos of them on the toilet being posted on Facebook (and now a news article; wtf was the Tech Review thinking).

Face blurred, no way to see who it is (though I haven't checked for EXIF in the picture, that would be fubar). IMHO and I don't expect anyone else to share it, the picture drives the surveillance aspect home better than word would, though perhaps that makes more of a difference for people who don't ordinarily read Tech Review.

It is still mortifying to have a photo of you sitting on the toilet with your shorts down even if your face is blurred out. Yes, the damage has already done and this made the article even more compelling, but I don't think it was necessary or appropriate.

Re: How did Roomba-recorded photos end up on Facebook?

#133

Post by qwerty456127 »

> hey were the sorts of scenes that internet-connected devices regularly capture and send back to the cloud

Most of the home devices like vacuum robots really have no valid reason to connect to any cloud let alone send any pictures there. Such a robot can run all the necessary code [ran in the cloud normally] on itself. If only the consumers would not be so naive to accept the cloud bullshit for a norm.

Re: How did Roomba-recorded photos end up on Facebook?

#134

Post by aglavine »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #133

> hey were the sorts of scenes that internet-connected devices regularly capture and send back to the cloud Most of the home devices like vacuum robots really have no valid reason to connect to any cloud let alone send any pictures there. Such a robot can run all the necessary code [ran in the cloud normally] on itself. If only the consumers would not be so naive to accept the cloud bullshit for a norm.

Real data of robots getting stuck is a valid reason to improve performance and avoid common real case scenarios impossible to replicate in test cases.

Re: How did Roomba-recorded photos end up on Facebook?

#135

Post by TheHappyOddish »

gernb wrote: post #65
huhtenberg wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's a funny bit. Roomba iOS app refuses to go past its welcome screen unless its granted access to the location info. This is unreasonable, they don't need this info for their app to function. However their devices are all but unusable without an app, so they ultimately blackmail people into giving location data to them. Meaning they don't really give a sh#t about users' privacy, so it's not that "they are watchin…

And, so, did you do the right thing and return it or did you just accept and therefore effectively indicate to Roomba by your actions that you're ok with it? I've returned several "smart" devices that required an app and an account. One example is GoVee smart blubs. As soon as they refused to work without an account I sent them back. Another is some Meross smart outlets. I retuned them for Eve Energy outlets.

I returned my $4000 LG TV after 2 years of use, as they suddenly tried to force me to agree to a new set of T&Cs and privacy policy. I called them and they told me that there's no way for me to continue using the TV without agreeing. Incredibly illegal (in my country), but I doubt most people notice or care.

Re: How did Roomba-recorded photos end up on Facebook?

#136

Post by Cthulhu_ »

na4ma4 wrote: post #116
huhtenberg wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's a funny bit. Roomba iOS app refuses to go past its welcome screen unless its granted access to the location info. This is unreasonable, they don't need this info for their app to function. However their devices are all but unusable without an app, so they ultimately blackmail people into giving location data to them. Meaning they don't really give a sh#t about users' privacy, so it's not that "they are watchin…

The dishwasher I got was the same, the app wanted access to location at all times (precise not approximate). If I disabled the permission it would stop working. So I switched to the home assistant integration for it and removed the app from my phone.

I'm pretty sure it's to enable a feature where it can turn on when you leave the house. However, that should be an optional feature, with them only asking for location tracking when you actually enable the option.

Should be, but here's the thing: they don't want to build the best app or customer experience through convenient features, they want your (location) data, because aggregated, that shit is worth more than the stupid dishwasher.

They don't make money on selling dishwashers anymore; components, shipping, marketing and middle men will swallow up any profit. But location data and subscriptions will bring in the real money, over a long and continuous period of time.

See also this story from a Twitter engineer who talked to mobile phone companies that were prepared to pay big money for location data; I can't find the source anymore, but it's been reposted on various outlets: https://hindupost.in/media/an-ex-twitter-engineer-reveals-ho...

Re: How did Roomba-recorded photos end up on Facebook?

#137

Post by Cthulhu_ »

sofixa wrote: post #127
noduerme wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why on earth would a dishwasher need an app? You have to load it before you start it... later, you walk by, it's done, you unload it.

The main use cases are around notifications - it's done, it needs X/Y consumable, A/B maintenance, etc.

And with location data, turning it on when leaving the house.

Another smart scenario I can think of, link it with energy prices and a real-time dynamic energy contract, and/or solar panel output or battery charge levels, to only run it when it's cheapest to do so.

Of course, that means having it stand-by to run at all times, meaning it may run half-empty and you need to keep the door closed which will cause mold etc.

Re: How did Roomba-recorded photos end up on Facebook?

#138

Post by Cthulhu_ »

anshumankmr wrote: post #90
adav wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't have a Roomba (or have used their app) but when something annoyingly insists on my location to setup/install, I just hit "Allow Once" with "Precise: Off" just to get past that screen. Then you can turn off the Location Services to "Never" for that app in Settings straight after. Not perfect but good enough?

This can be fixed by an app update as they may check each time you open the app whether they have the required permissions or not.

Didn't Android have a feature at some point where you could opt to supply it with a fake location? Maybe that was 'hacked' Android phones.

Either way, Android (and iOS) should be stricter about these things; apps should work without any permissions. I mean a navigation app without location access won't work very well and permission can be denied by accident, but that can be resolved.

Re: How did Roomba-recorded photos end up on Facebook?

#139

Post by huhtenberg »

operator-name wrote: post #62
huhtenberg wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. Out of spite I took the iPad to a friend's house, enabled location, clicked through the welcome screen and disabled it again. Then came back home and hooked up the device. So, no, it's not linked to its BT needs at all.

How did you connect your device to your wireless network?

You connect to it via BT first and then configure WiFi details.

Re: How did Roomba-recorded photos end up on Facebook?

#140

Post by simonebrunozzi »

huhtenberg wrote: post #36
andrewxdiamond wrote: post #4

Key paragraph for our friends who don’t RTFA > iRobot … confirmed that these images were captured by its Roombas in 2020. All of them came from “special development robots with hardware and software modifications that are not and never were present on iRobot consumer products for purchase,” the company said in a statement. They were given to “paid collectors and employees” who signed written agreements acknowledging…

Here's a funny bit. Roomba iOS app refuses to go past its welcome screen unless its granted access to the location info. This is unreasonable, they don't need this info for their app to function. However their devices are all but unusable without an app, so they ultimately blackmail people into giving location data to them. Meaning they don't really give a sh#t about users' privacy, so it's not that "they are watchin…

This sucks, and it would normally be Apple's App Store duty to remove an app that requests unreasonable access to the device's details.
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