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Why aren't smart people happier?

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Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#131

Post by Jensson »

badpun wrote: post #122
throwawaythekey wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A possible explanation is that the mellowing is due to the loss of acuity with age. The more likely explanation is that it's an evolutionary adaption in response to how ones function in society changes with age.

I think it's just increased wisdom and maturity. Some people need a certain number of years (their twenties) before you start noticing how pointless and bad for you it is to be angry at the world.

I think it is more you start out trying to fix the worlds problems, and then after some years you give up and become happier. I don't think it is wisdom or maturity, many people give up as a kid and just go through the motions from the start, I wouldn't call those wise or mature.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#132

Post by creakingstairs »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #124
nickelcitymario wrote: post #108

I actually would not expect smart people to be happier. In fact, I wouldn't expect any group of people to be particularly happier than anyone else. Happiness and suffering are two sides of the same coin and we evolved these feelings (or they were bestowed upon us by God, either way) in order to guide us. We do more of what feels good, less of what feels bad. If we're happy all the time, happiness loses its intended p…

> That's why, no matter what financial windfall you may experience, give it 6 months and you'll be just as miserable (or worse) as you were before. But because you got a high off of it initially, you keep pursuing more and more, always convinced the next upgrade in your life is what will do the trick. But it doesn't. All you're doing is raising the bar for what it takes to make you momentarily happy. I am pretty sure…

I agree. When I was counting every dollar to survive, I was a nervous wreck. I had no capacity to be happy. Now I can buy whatever I want during grocery without caring. I’m not necessarily happier, but I have the capacity to be happy.

But I’m guessing what the OP meant was after basic affluence is met(which probably varies wildly by person), then more money does not correlate with happiness. Which I would also agree with.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#133

Post by synu »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #124
nickelcitymario wrote: post #108

I actually would not expect smart people to be happier. In fact, I wouldn't expect any group of people to be particularly happier than anyone else. Happiness and suffering are two sides of the same coin and we evolved these feelings (or they were bestowed upon us by God, either way) in order to guide us. We do more of what feels good, less of what feels bad. If we're happy all the time, happiness loses its intended p…

> That's why, no matter what financial windfall you may experience, give it 6 months and you'll be just as miserable (or worse) as you were before. But because you got a high off of it initially, you keep pursuing more and more, always convinced the next upgrade in your life is what will do the trick. But it doesn't. All you're doing is raising the bar for what it takes to make you momentarily happy. I am pretty sure…

Very much the same here. I grew up without security of those things either, and never quite managed to lose the appreciation or happiness in finding a career in tech that pulled me out of that. Buddha-like dispassionate observation of my situation wasn't really an option, or at least I wasn't capable of it.

Something else that helped, I think, is that when I did have a life-changing windfall (a company stock actually paid out) I didn't change anything in my life. I just use it to do relatively humble but satisfying things, like family vacations that I wouldn't have had access to before. I imagine if I had blown it all on parties or something I'd have had major ups and downs, but having it be a source of stability and little happiness bubbles released over a long period of time has been really positive.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#134

Post by pid-1 »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #124
nickelcitymario wrote: post #108

I actually would not expect smart people to be happier. In fact, I wouldn't expect any group of people to be particularly happier than anyone else. Happiness and suffering are two sides of the same coin and we evolved these feelings (or they were bestowed upon us by God, either way) in order to guide us. We do more of what feels good, less of what feels bad. If we're happy all the time, happiness loses its intended p…

> That's why, no matter what financial windfall you may experience, give it 6 months and you'll be just as miserable (or worse) as you were before. But because you got a high off of it initially, you keep pursuing more and more, always convinced the next upgrade in your life is what will do the trick. But it doesn't. All you're doing is raising the bar for what it takes to make you momentarily happy. I am pretty sure…

I often think about the law of diminishing returns. My finances had a few inflection points that improved my life tremendously:

- Left the violent neighborhood I grew up at

- Was able to eat real food every day

- Started being able to save money

- Stopped using public transport

- Got a place for myself

- Got a job with great work life balance

Now, every extra cash I make improves my peace of mind, as my biggest fear is being poor again. I don't think any extra luxury will ever make me happier than the points I outlined above did.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#135

Post by fendy3002 »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #124
nickelcitymario wrote: post #108

I actually would not expect smart people to be happier. In fact, I wouldn't expect any group of people to be particularly happier than anyone else. Happiness and suffering are two sides of the same coin and we evolved these feelings (or they were bestowed upon us by God, either way) in order to guide us. We do more of what feels good, less of what feels bad. If we're happy all the time, happiness loses its intended p…

> That's why, no matter what financial windfall you may experience, give it 6 months and you'll be just as miserable (or worse) as you were before. But because you got a high off of it initially, you keep pursuing more and more, always convinced the next upgrade in your life is what will do the trick. But it doesn't. All you're doing is raising the bar for what it takes to make you momentarily happy. I am pretty sure…

And after I've learned about four noble truths in Buddhism, I began to appreciate my situation and become averagely happier than before.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#136

Post by alberth »

necovek wrote: post #71
alberth wrote: post #39

Shouldn’t the real question be “why aren’t more people happy”. Lack of happiness isn’t relegated only to “smart people”. My observation: managing stress related to ever growing amount of responsibilities (as comes with age), finances, and spouse can have a disproportionate impact on one’s happiness. None of which are tied to intelligence.

What do you mean are not tied to intelligence? If you use your smarts to conclude that having a spouse will negatively affect your happiness, don't have one. A very intelligent person should be able to figure out a way to improve their finances. The article makes the distinction between well-defined problems (eg. increase my monthly income) and poorly defined problems (eg. find a spouse that matches you for life), an…

> If you use your smarts to conclude that having a spouse will negatively affect your happiness, don't have one.

You're assuming the negative. Your spouse can be a huge overall help in achieving happiness.

> A very intelligent person should be able to figure out a way to improve their finances.

It's not that simple.

You could be exceedingly smart but medically handicapped, which leads to lower paying jobs. Or could have been a high earner and then come down with an unfortunate disease which greatly impacts you ability to work and medically bankrupts you.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#137

Post by _gabe_ »

YeahNO wrote: post #115
willcipriano wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Get to know your bosses. Like really get to know them. Mine have told me stories about how their wives left them because they made less than a million one year. Or how their kids are strung out on drugs beacuse they failed to be around them often enough growing up. When they have a conversation, 90% of the time it's about how many widgets the widget factory is going to pump out next month. Old friends come out of the…

"Christianity prohibited the coveting of your neighbor not because it would make God angry, but because it makes your life worse." Citation needed. It's one of the commandments: “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, or his male slave, or his female slave, or his ox, or his donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor.” Exodus 20:17 (NASB). A book of magical thinkin…

> You would be better served studying philosophy directly, rather than a book filled with misogyny, slavery, thought-crime and magic.

Quite a hot take. Most famous philosophers lived in similar environments. I don't know how your environment precludes you from wisdom.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#138

Post by rTX5CMRXIfFG »

nickelcitymario wrote: post #108

I actually would not expect smart people to be happier. In fact, I wouldn't expect any group of people to be particularly happier than anyone else. Happiness and suffering are two sides of the same coin and we evolved these feelings (or they were bestowed upon us by God, either way) in order to guide us. We do more of what feels good, less of what feels bad. If we're happy all the time, happiness loses its intended p…

Stoicism and buddhism never worked for me—observing the world as dispassionately as possible is the most dead I’ve ever felt inside. Pouring myself out as passionately as possible to what I consider my life’s work is the happiest, most satisfying feeling in the world, and that’s despite the setbacks.

I still come across as stoic to some people, though, just because it takes a lot (if at all) to upset me, but my calmness is not borne out of dispassion—I really just know now which arguments or fights are worth having and with whom, and the vast majority of those arguments and people are simply inconsequential.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#139

Post by synu »

Apreche wrote: post #40

The smarter people see the truth of the world and the universe. If the truth was good, that we lived in a wonderful society with wonderful people in a universe that cares about us, smart people would be so happy. But being smart just means you know the awful reality of things. Congrats, you learned about all these awful things you can’t do much to fix, and the reward is you get to experience existential dread. Congra…

But surely even not "smart" people get to experience the awful reality of things, and realize that there isn't much you can do about it?

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#140

Post by 2000UltraDeluxe »

sumtechguy wrote: post #110
2000UltraDeluxe wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It sounds like you're confusing intelligence with depressive realism and cynicism. :) Sure, the universe itself is indifferent at best, but that doesn't mean you can't find meaning in life, or that you can't experience happiness. On the contrary, admitting that most things are completely outside one's control seems to be a key to being happy with life.

Realism is seeing an issue and recognizing that it is a problem. Intelligence is seeing an issue and recognizing that it is a problem and recognizing the root issues to how it became a problem. Proper action is seeing both of the above and addressing the immediate issues and the longer term ones so the problem does not happen again. Cynicism comes from when you are not allowed any sort of action and actively denied t…

Indeed! And accepting that some things are outside one's control is when you move on instead of believing people who say you are wrong.
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