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Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

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Re: Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

#131

Post by prionassembly »

denton-scratch wrote: post #44
sdfhdhjdw3 wrote: post #28

Oh jesus christ, the constant whining! This is science. This is how it works. Maybe there's nothing else to discover, maybe it will take us 100 years, we don't know, that's why it's called research.

> Maybe there's nothing else to discover AFAICS that is not one of the options; there are mysteries and contradictions whose explanations remain to be discovered. But maybe we can't discover more using the LHC (which I doubt).

There's the mythology of the heavens being held up by the titan Atlas, who rests on top of a cow, which rests on top of a turtle... the kiddy version continues on top of another turtle, on top of...

I once had a vision -- yes, a vision, something deep came to me as I laid half-awake -- that after a few dozen turtles the actual ground was made of jackstraw[1]. It rested on a firm tangle.

I've always felt since then that the world and the universe themselves are made of contradictions. That some contradictions are fundamental, and this is why since Socrates we've always been so focused on finding contradictions. Because maybe we can find the ones we can't pick apart.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pick-up_sticks

Re: Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

#134

Post by vanderZwan »

dlsa wrote: post #85
vanderZwan wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Have you had a good look? Are you aware of how hilarious it is in the context of high energy physicists verifying the standard model to ask if they had "good look"? I don't think a collective effort to look any harder has ever existed in the history of humankind.

I've received feedback from some very smart people who laughed out loud and knew exactly what I meant by having a good look . Two of them are physicists and many more are engineers. They said they have found many metaphorical couches and there's a lot of nothing. They've also found quite a few interesting metaphorical paperclips and other debris. But that there's so many more places to look. They also think there's a…

Yeah I assumed your comment was in good faith, and as a physics drop-out I'm well aware of how most people have no idea of the sheer scope of these research projects, so I didn't mean it as a jab against you.

Re: Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

#135

Post by walnutclosefarm »

There is an existential angst amongst particle physicists because they all understand that they are the thoroughbred pets of the scientific world. Even if they find something, it doesn't matter, because they are working in energy regimes that are not reachable in the ordinary physics of the universe as it exists today. Even the discovery that the Higgs Boson as a lighter mass than predicted, while intellectually intriguing doesn't matter outside the very small circle of high energy and theoretical physicists. In many ways, their field is already dead - they just haven't acknowledged it yet.

Re: Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

#136

Post by birdyrooster »

vanderZwan wrote: post #52
dlsa wrote: post #27

At least they are finding nothing and confirming they are finding nothing. Less scrupulous operators might be always finding something even if its not there. So that's a sign of good science. Maybe there's something they haven't found because there's so much data? Mix things up and look again? Change assumptions? Or as someone I know likes to say to various smaller humans: have you looked around the couch? Really? Ar…

> Have you had a good look? Are you aware of how hilarious it is in the context of high energy physicists verifying the standard model to ask if they had "good look"? I don't think a collective effort to look any harder has ever existed in the history of humankind.

Bike shedding for the senses

Re: Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

#138

Post by Shahar603 »

fithisux wrote: post #43

They could open projects in a git hosting site, publish their code in a polished form. They can even contribute to various projects related to their work. Or create a data hosting service for others to examine them.

What if the people at CERN made a tool so they can communicate amongst themselves more easily, as well as everyone else in the world too.

Re: Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

#139

Post by raxxorraxor »

dlsa wrote: post #27

At least they are finding nothing and confirming they are finding nothing. Less scrupulous operators might be always finding something even if its not there. So that's a sign of good science. Maybe there's something they haven't found because there's so much data? Mix things up and look again? Change assumptions? Or as someone I know likes to say to various smaller humans: have you looked around the couch? Really? Ar…

There probably is a hard limit on how many elemental particles you can find in the first place. I don't know if there are further theories. Are there X or Y-Bosons? Lowfat quark anti-particles?
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