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In Praise of Memorization

pearlleff.com

131–140 of 152 posts

Re: In Praise of Memorization

#131
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I'm of the opinion that this leads to a good rule of thumb: never memorize anything Did you ever learn another language? It's impossible without memorizing a massive amount of things, especially when the writing system is different than the one one is familiar with. In fact the most famous researcher in vocabulary learning (Paul Nation) states in one of his book that rote learning is one of the most efficient use of…

I can't speak for the GP, but my personal experience is also that I really dislike memorization. That being said, I speak 5 languages, have written books in two of them, have given public presentation in three and can introduce myself and go and buy bread in a few more. That's in addition to computer languages, of course :) I suspect that the parts of the brain involving in learning by rote and learning a new languag…

I speak 7 languages (learning an 8th) and can relate to remembering things in context being more effective than rote memorization.

That said, some types of rote memorization do help accelerate learning. In language learning I often come across fundamental words that don’t occur frequently enough for me to internalize automatically but yet occur frequently enough to block comprehension when encountered (it’s little words like “put” or “place”). For these words, I just put them in Anki in sentence context and do a few rounds of spaced repetition to get them in my system.

In my opinion Anki shouldn’t be used for core vocabulary but it’s useful for reinforcing and “cleaning up” words on the fringes that one doesn’t encounter that often but that are very useful.

Re: In Praise of Memorization

#132
post #76
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Good memorization skills are a huge leverage and it is something that can be learned and practiced. Any recommendations in how to get better at memorization?

I've been working on an app [0] for the past few years that attempts to synthesize note card style note taking (a la zettelkasten method) with spaced repetition flash cards. Spaced repetition is the single most effective tool for efficient memorization that I've discovered. [0] https://mochi.cards/

Cool! Is this only for MacOS, or iOS also?

Re: In Praise of Memorization

#134

Anyone who's interested in this way of learning, I'd recommend you to check out retrieval-based learning (1): "Retrieval is the key process for understanding learning and for promoting learning, yet retrieval is not often granted the central role it deserves. Learning is typically identified with the encoding or construction of knowledge, and retrieval is considered merely the assessment of learning that occurred in…

So, active recall?

Active recall (asking yourself questions about the text) is better than passive recall (rereading the text).

Re: In Praise of Memorization

#135
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's possible to get to the point where you can become better at effortless memorization, but that takes a LOT of work. I studied 6 languages in high school and undergrad, and by the time I was in my senior year (taking Arabic + Chinese concurrently + over a decade of cumulative language classes) I remembered pretty much everything and reviewing for things like formulae/terms in other classes wasn't necessary. It's j…

Hi I'm interested in this, can you talk more about the process and stages you went through?

It wasn't a process so much as an accidental by-product of what I was studying. By the time I left high school, I was taking German, Latin, and French. In undergrad, I expanded that to include some Old English, Mandarin Chinese, and Arabic. You can't get around memorization to learn languages.

The reason my memory ended up so nuts is that I was only interested in the nuts and bolts of the language, so I didn't continue on with French when it became about literature, I just picked up a new language instead. After a while, languages become more about things like context clues, but at the beginning and intermediate stages, you have to memorize a lot. Since I wanted to go for linguistic breadth (since I was interested in how languages were related/how features travel), I did the memorization stage of language learning a lot.

So I'd say it's down to consistency and longevity of practice. I used spaced-repetition as my main technique, but it's really down to spending 1+ hour a day for 8 years on memorizing.

You also have to keep up with it, or your memory degrades. It's been a good 10 years, and I don't have nearly the memory I used to.

Re: In Praise of Memorization

#136
I think heuristics are much more important than knowing semantics. Someone who can memorize all the notes on a piano faster than their peer isn't necessarily going to be better at piano in the long run.

Similarly, there was an idea expressed in chess where some people rely on memory to reproduce thousands of similar scenarios, while others rely on the "feel" of the chessboard and the various heuristics related to it (e.g. is the king "safe" -- e.g. castled and not exposed etc., are the bishops "powerful and free to roam" -- e.g. not blocked by pawns or heavily contested etc.).

My argument partially comes from self-defense; my memory is comparatively poor. But I'm able to use heuristics developed over years of experience to make generally good decisions.

So in this case:

"Who would you rather hire: the person who knows exactly what features are available in PHP 7 and which are only available in PHP 8, or the one who will figure it out by trial-and-error of while writing each application and seeing what fails?"

I would hire the person who is able to write the best application, and understand when to use what features or not: similar to the Bond quote "Sometimes a trigger needs to be pulled -- Or not pulled, it's tough to know which in your pajamas". If memory was the most important part of cognitive ability computers would serve a much larger role in society than the (already large) part they do today.

Re: In Praise of Memorization

#137
Use method of loci. It's an almost trivially learned skill, and once you've got the technique down, you can expand it as needed, or riff on the basics with other mnemonics to amplify the speed and volume of memorization capacity.

Rote learning is difficult, and unnecessary. Your brain already automatically memorized places, faces, and novel things. If you can imagine Elvis in a wizard robe holding a block of cheese on your front porch, you have a one item memory palace. That's the level of difficulty a memory palace requires - it's a hack of built in automatic functions your brain is already performing.

Elite memory athletes who memorize the order of thousands of cards, or tens of thousands of digits of pi, or a travel dictionary, or any other assortment of things - these people are often average intelligence, otherwise normal folks who just practice a neat trick.

There are dozens, if not hundreds of "advanced" memory, mnemonics, or method of loci primers. Get one and develop a superpower.

I like "Memory Improvement" by Ron White - you can grok it in an afternoon, but it's structured into 30 daily exercises, and captures all the important features without fluff or filler. The audiobooks is great, 4 hours long. A motivated person could master the skill over a weekend with nothing but the audio.

Seriously. Method of loci is a basic human skill that gets attributed to genius characters like Sherlock or Tony Stark or Einstein level intellects, or to shamans and druids and mystics. It's a default feature that comes in every install - it's how your brain wants to work. Every single person can do it, and should.

Re: In Praise of Memorization

#138
post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, a good memorization skill must not necessarily mean you come to the right conclusions. Your sources, peers, genetics and a mind that is by nature chaotic, do it's part. For example, having good memory may lead you to become more arrogant. If other people praise you for your skill, you become so confident in your conclusions that you stop questioning them and rather see confirmation in an echo chamb…

A good memory might lead you into evil? Are you being serious?

There is a type of person who can only reply with "smart people can do bad things" when discussing competence in any form.

But there are only so many ways you can say "smart people can do bad things" without sounding repetitive, and it looks like they're scraping at the bottom of the barrel.

Re: In Praise of Memorization

#139
post #64

When encountering a new concept (a definition, a theorem) memorization is more important than understanding. Yes, you can spend time trying to crack the meaning, but you won’t unless you spend enough time contemplating examples and trying to imagine counter-examples. It’s a struggle. A more efficient way of gaining understanding is, first, to have things you do not (yet) fully understand memorized to the letter, and…

I think people are confusing "memorization" with "practice". "Practice" is really important and "memorization" is both the prerequiste and result of "practice".

I often tell people "Calculus is just algebra. However, it's fast, repeated algebra. If you aren't excellent at algebra, calculus is going to be terrible for you. On the flip side, calculus forces you to use your algebra so much that you get much better at it."

Re: In Praise of Memorization

#140

There was an HN poster a few months ago who claimed that memorizing the Python standard library made him much more productive.

But... but... I thought best practice was to use autocomplete or Copilot and let the IDE remember things for me!
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