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Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

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Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#131

Post by MisterBastahrd »

disiplus wrote: post #100
torginus wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure what you are claiming. You probably won't get $300k in the EU, but if you do, a greater proportion of it will go to taxes - the things you get in return, like pensions or healthcare aren't as attractive at that income level. While US healthcare is very expensive, it's a service, which means it's tied to how much you pay, and not defined as a percentage of your gross income. If you make that much money, y…

at that pay level in Europe you are almost certainly not going to social healthcare because in most of them you will not get the same level of service as in private hospital and will lose more time. so u usually end up paying the healthcare and using it only in extreme circumcises. there is Switzerland where that is different.

Please look up where the US ranks in healthcare quality globally before trying to denigrate other countries' health services.

(hint: it ain't good)

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#132

Post by bluedino »

brianmcc wrote: post #29

I am sceptical. Reminds me of the predictions 20 years ago that outsourcing/offshoring would eliminate hands-on developer jobs in US/UK and other "expensive" countries. Timezones, language factors, cultural factors, retention and exclusivity challenges plus basic logistics stuff like payroll and taxes all matter a lot. None of that's insurmountable but it takes a level of effort that can be very high. And I say this…

>> outsourcing/offshoring would eliminate hands-on developer jobs in US/UK and other "expensive" countries

Remember companies like EDS? During the 80's and 90's all the development and support for the 'big' companies in the USA was done by companies like EDS. They employed hundreds of thousands of people. Then in 2000's they started going to India etc.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#133

Post by monkeybutton »

brundolf wrote: post #129
zz865 wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Reminds me of the predictions 20 years ago that outsourcing/offshoring would eliminate hands-on developer jobs in US/UK and other "expensive" countries. Well in the corporate world offshoring really is everywhere. Even Goldman Sach's, #2 office for engineers in is Bangalore.

Large corps have an economy of scale with this stuff. The smaller the company, the bigger a barrier it is

Maybe they've always existed and I'm only noticing now because of remote working but there's a whole industry of companies that provide HR and IT (helpdesk level) services for smaller, distributed companies so you don't have to take on that additional overhead yourself. I think there's definitely potential for the corporate equivalent of geeksquad in the remote working future.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#135

Post by Hermitian909 »

sweezyjeezy wrote: post #83
bwb wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed, but if you read down the list the author notes in that list Panama, Croatia, which while beautiful and stable in some ways... are also knows for corruption and other issues. The USA is very affordable if you look outside of SF/NY and compare it to Western Europe (esp with tech pay). What are you comparing it too?

It's certainly affordable with tech pay - but... that's the point of the article isn't it? Tech pay is sky high because US is overvaluing US talent. Most millennials in the US cannot afford to buy a home here. Agreed Panama is a bad example, but not Croatia - it's politically stable, and I don't believe many people leave because of corruption.

> Tech pay is sky high because US is overvaluing US talent

This statement feels like it requires a lot of justification. I work for a large company, we are happy to hire out of Europe, SA, or anywhere else so long as they can work on their team's time zone. We are willing to beat basically any offer you'd imagine getting in those areas and hiring is still hard, qualified and experienced people are a rarity.

When thinking about "overvaluing talent" it's worth remembering that just 5 years ago the big tech companies actively conspired to keep pay down because margins on developers making 120-150k were just insanely high[0].

[0] https://www.npr.org/sections/alltechconsidered/2015/01/16/37...

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#136

Post by Cyberdogs7 »

root_axis wrote: post #125
flatiron wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The politicians will fight back with work visas and limits etc. protecting domestic work forces should be a primary concern for politicians.

Visas and similar restrictions are not a factor for remote work.

Yes, they are. Having an LLC based in Texas, trying to hiring a remote employee in NYC. I have to comply with all local NYC laws and taxes. Luckily it's a developer. If it was a sales person, it could make the whole company liable for income tax in New York state.

Even worse when you talk international. An Amazon USA based employee is forbidden from working remotely in India, because of all the legal issues it would cause for Amazon USA.

It's a very complicated issue, in which each individual government is fighting to get a slice of the tax pie. Reference article: https://therealdeal.com/2021/05/07/ny-tax-officials-crack-do...

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#137

Post by oceanplexian »

JohnWhigham wrote: post #14

In the short term, I think it's going to be a lot harder than this article lets on, but long term, it is abundantly clear: cushy developer jobs in the US are on borrowed time. Salaries may continue to go up for a little while longer, but they will fall to reflect the rest of the world catching up with the US. And that's a scary prospect for those under 35 now. And I don't think there's a way out of it. We embrace rem…

The Internet is global, and there's been nothing stopping someone in India, for example, from starting the next Facebook. Ironically, if the world was catching up to the US then it wouldn't be US companies doing the hiring, making the whole thing a moot point.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#138

Post by zcw100 »

Much ado about nothing. Developer jobs have been able to be outsourced and work remote for a couple of decades. If it was going to go that way it would have long ago. The rest of the world might be catching up to the remote work game but software development has been there, done that. If anything we've already experienced a pullback where outsourced developer jobs have been pulled back when they experienced the problems with it.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#140

Post by e4325f »

qaq wrote: post #43
0xy wrote: post #7

I don't buy it, US tech salaries continue to skyrocket and we're nearly two years into pandemic conditions. Just over the last 6-9 months, salaries have markedly jumped. There's still a huge thirst for talent that isn't being quenched, and global pools don't help either. Facebook, Google and others have satellite offices all over to soak up talent elsewhere, but they're still ultra competitive in the US. They can pay…

It's not that drastic anymore people getting 350 total comp in US would get 200K Euro total comp in say Dublin, Ireland

bollocks
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