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The metaverse is already here – it's Minecraft

clivethompson.medium.com

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Re: The metaverse is already here – it's Minecraft

#131

Post by psyc »

one_off_comment wrote: post #96
astlouis44 wrote: post #87

No, it is not. Neither is Roblox or Fortnite, or VRchat. A single game or world is NOT the metaverse, what is so hard to understand about that for journalists and companies? The metaverse is the immersive internet, as a successor to our current one that is more 2D oriented around photos/videos/text today. It's a paradigm shift in how we interact, but most importantly there will be many of these virtual worlds/spaces…

If the web was created today, it would not be a set of open protocols, markup languages, etc. It would be a product. That's the world we live in, so that's why journalists and companies chase that vision. There's obviously no way to be sure, but the only reason the web was created how it was is because it was a bunch of academics, nerds, and hobbyists who saw a need and filled it. There was no perceived money in it f…

And it was a trade off. I think most of us are well acquainted with the advertised advantages of open standards and web application architecture as we know it. But it came at the expense of both user experience and developer experience on par with traditional desktop applications. E.g. arbitrary languages (esp. compiled languages), fast graphics, great UI toolkits. We get some approximation of such things at a glacial pace, or it’s always just over the horizon. Everybody is leery of adopting a comprehensive framework only backed by a single corporation (is this what held Java back?) but standards bodies take 20 years to deliver a bright idea like compiling your favorite language to byte code that can execute in the browser.

Re: The metaverse is already here – it's Minecraft

#132

Post by yazaddaruvala »

kibwen wrote: post #49
vineyardmike wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read a recent interview from mark zuck about the metaverse and someone asked him a similar question. He had an actually really insightful answer. 1) Most american adults watch several hours of TV per day. alternatively, many play a few hours of video games. (The actual per-person-per-day numbers are very high compared to the average 2hr/week i watch tv but whatever). Most of TV and Video Games are about ignoring re…

I'm frustrated that everywhere I look I keep seeing "metaverse" and "VR" used interchangeably. All of the things described above are VR, and none of them are the metaverse. Watching TV or playing a game in an immersive, distraction-free VR environment sounds great, and will happen, and it's not the metaverse, it's just VR. Working in a virtual home office has the potential to be extremely productive, ergonomic, and s…

Frankly the problem is, none of these are really well defined. I think Zuck wants the general consensus to lean towards:

VR - Is a user interface. Metaverse is a network built for that user interface.

Historically, we had screen and keyboard based user interfaces, and with it text based gaming like Zork. Then we had screen and controller based user interfaces, and with it games like Pong. At a certain point we got the screen and mouse user interface, and with it FPS, RTS, like Warcraft and Doom. Touch screens were again a new user interface and with it came games like Fruit Ninja. VR now exists as a user interface (although still needs to be improved) and many people love playing Skyrim with it, or Beat Saber.

All of these were mostly local experiences with different (better?) user interfaces.

Meanwhile, each user interface had its own networks that were built on them. e.g. Email is a "first class network" built on the text based user interface. e.g. WWW is a "first class network" built on the mouse based user interface.

The metaverse isn't a new user interface. The metaverse is a "first class network" built on top of the VR based user interface.

Re: The metaverse is already here – it's Minecraft

#133

Post by bamboozled »

vineyardmike wrote: post #41
clpm4j wrote: post #18

(Aware of the fact that I'm taking time out of my day to read HN) I really wonder how many adults > 25yrs and < 60yrs have the time to immerse themselves in any type of digital world / metaverse experience. If I was a teenager or in college, then yeah I can see it... but there are so many things to do in the 16hrs we have each day, and I already kick myself for not finishing that book, or getting an extra workout in,…

I read a recent interview from mark zuck about the metaverse and someone asked him a similar question. He had an actually really insightful answer. 1) Most american adults watch several hours of TV per day. alternatively, many play a few hours of video games. (The actual per-person-per-day numbers are very high compared to the average 2hr/week i watch tv but whatever). Most of TV and Video Games are about ignoring re…

"Thats 8+ hours a day you can spend in metaverse."

I hope he plans to be spending 8 hours a day in "metaverse" but I'm sure as fuck not going to be.

Re: The metaverse is already here – it's Minecraft

#134

Post by darkwater »

derac wrote: post #76
vineyardmike wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read a recent interview from mark zuck about the metaverse and someone asked him a similar question. He had an actually really insightful answer. 1) Most american adults watch several hours of TV per day. alternatively, many play a few hours of video games. (The actual per-person-per-day numbers are very high compared to the average 2hr/week i watch tv but whatever). Most of TV and Video Games are about ignoring re…

I'm incredulous that having a screen strapped half an inch from your eyes for 8+ hours is desirable. I have an Oculus Rift, my face is sweaty/red in a couple of hours and there is an indent around my eyes. I'm sure newer tech can be much better, especially with airflow and an AR set that lets in natural light. We're not there yet, though.

I just got to try an Oculus Quest 2 and I was really blown away by how advanced it is, I didn't expect that. But at least in my case and at my age after a 2-3 hours of full use (when you run out of battery) my eyes are really tired and I was scratching them for a few days after. So, it still need one extra generation at least, probably an "iPhone-like" moment but it's definitely addictive.

Re: The metaverse is already here – it's Minecraft

#135

Post by nightpool »

astlouis44 wrote: post #87

No, it is not. Neither is Roblox or Fortnite, or VRchat. A single game or world is NOT the metaverse, what is so hard to understand about that for journalists and companies? The metaverse is the immersive internet, as a successor to our current one that is more 2D oriented around photos/videos/text today. It's a paradigm shift in how we interact, but most importantly there will be many of these virtual worlds/spaces…

Minecraft is actually a great example here—the client and server ecosystem is extremely, extremely diverse, with lots of different choices for users. Almost everyone who uses Minecraft on desktop is running some mod, if only Optifine, and the server landscape is even more diverse, with dozens of competing reimplementations, all communicating over a shared protocol. I think Minecraft is a great example in the current landscape of a naturally evolved diverse, unowned network of interactive virtual spaces. If Mojang disappeared tomorrow, the only thing the community would need to solve is authentication (and for our use-case, something like mTLS would work super well)

Re: The metaverse is already here – it's Minecraft

#136

Post by [deleted] »

kibwen wrote: post #115
Closi wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think metaverse is just a fancy name for communicating with people online supported by technology (both present technology, future technology and meatspace communications supported by technology). It’s clear from Facebook’s presentations for instance that they consider text messaging via WhatsApp to class as part of the metaverse. It’s not anything new, but I think the metaverse strategy is basically Facebook sayin…

I would classify it as slightly more than communication; a metaverse also has to give you some way to "inhabit" it. We're communicating on HN, but HN doesn't really have a way to inhabit it, so I wouldn't call HN a metaverse.

[deleted]

Re: The metaverse is already here – it's Minecraft

#137

Post by nradov »

vineyardmike wrote: post #41
clpm4j wrote: post #18

(Aware of the fact that I'm taking time out of my day to read HN) I really wonder how many adults > 25yrs and < 60yrs have the time to immerse themselves in any type of digital world / metaverse experience. If I was a teenager or in college, then yeah I can see it... but there are so many things to do in the 16hrs we have each day, and I already kick myself for not finishing that book, or getting an extra workout in,…

I read a recent interview from mark zuck about the metaverse and someone asked him a similar question. He had an actually really insightful answer. 1) Most american adults watch several hours of TV per day. alternatively, many play a few hours of video games. (The actual per-person-per-day numbers are very high compared to the average 2hr/week i watch tv but whatever). Most of TV and Video Games are about ignoring re…

I hardly ever "watch" TV. But I often have the TV on while I'm doing something else.

With this metaverse stuff you have to wear the stupid goggles. You can't just have it on in the background and glance up if something interesting comes on. This is why 3D TVs failed in the market. The technology worked fine but most regular people didn't want to wear the goggles just to watch a movie.

Re: The metaverse is already here – it's Minecraft

#138

Post by sprkwd »

phailhaus wrote: post #126
astlouis44 wrote: post #87

No, it is not. Neither is Roblox or Fortnite, or VRchat. A single game or world is NOT the metaverse, what is so hard to understand about that for journalists and companies? The metaverse is the immersive internet, as a successor to our current one that is more 2D oriented around photos/videos/text today. It's a paradigm shift in how we interact, but most importantly there will be many of these virtual worlds/spaces…

It's pretty wild that Meta has gone all-in on this "metaverse" concept when VR as a platform has completely stagnated to date. VR still hasn't found its killer app, why is Meta so convinced that it's going to look like Second Life?

Do they know something we don’t?

Re: The metaverse is already here – it's Minecraft

#139

Post by jacquesm »

kibwen wrote: post #115
Closi wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think metaverse is just a fancy name for communicating with people online supported by technology (both present technology, future technology and meatspace communications supported by technology). It’s clear from Facebook’s presentations for instance that they consider text messaging via WhatsApp to class as part of the metaverse. It’s not anything new, but I think the metaverse strategy is basically Facebook sayin…

I would classify it as slightly more than communication; a metaverse also has to give you some way to "inhabit" it. We're communicating on HN, but HN doesn't really have a way to inhabit it, so I wouldn't call HN a metaverse.

Every registered user is an inhabitant, every passerby an observing alien that might convert into an inhabitant at some point.

Re: The metaverse is already here – it's Minecraft

#140

Post by GhettoComputers »

colordrops wrote: post #121
GhettoComputers wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Adoption is the issue, not the lack of open standards.

What are the standards around this? I was unaware of much, if any, recent development on such standards. Even so why is no one with adequate resources working on growing adoption of standards, whether it be academia, DARPA, or corporate entities?

Standards of online networking or the metaverse? Its the internet. You can run 3D crap in a browser.
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