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Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

drive.com.au

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Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#131

Post by clouddrover »

Le_Dook wrote: post #37
AustinDev wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ferarris don't contribute at all to global warming relatively. The many Gulfstream's and 747's the wealthy own are actually statistically significant in terms of impact.

Heck, I know they're hybrids but just look formula one. The total emissions of every car, from all sessions at every single race in a year combined produce less emissions than a one way flight from London to New York. Which is then completed negated by the fact that the drivers all take private jets around the world

F1 is moving to carbon neutral synthetic fuel:

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a37872650/formula-1-auto-r...

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#132

Post by readflaggedcomm »

paultnylund wrote: post #107
mfer wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is Norway handling the increased use of the electric grid? I ask because Elon noted the US power grid needed to double output to handle a full is transition

Last I heard, they actually have so much excess power that they're selling it to the UK.

Production could outstrip local distribution precisely because the excess is exported. It doesn't tell whether distribution can handle increased load.

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#133

Post by supperburg »

njovin wrote: post #97
ostenning wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meanwhile in Australia: electric cars are getting taxed more to support the aging oil infrastructure

Similar in California and other states. The states typically tax gasoline and since electrics don't use any they are implementing special fees on electric vehicle purchases to make up for lost revenue. One would think that the savings in pollution (not only for the car itself, but the transport of the fuel, pollution from refineries, etc.) would offset any lost revenue from gas taxes. What makes this really nonsensic…

Because in the states if you didn’t do that a bunch of idiots would accuse you of disproportionately taxing the poor since they can’t afford electric cars. Social justice at its finest.

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#134

Post by cat199 »

filoleg wrote: post #109
_3u10 wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, used EVs depreciate quickly. I'm comparing new Tesla Plaids to the C8 Corvette and due to depreciation its looking like the C8 will be much cheaper, and much more fun to drive. The C8 will drop 30k in 5 years according to C6/C7 data, whereas a Plaid will likely drop 70k. If I spend less than $800 a month on fuel the C8 is cheaper. Currently C8s are appreciating their first year, which is really weird. The Model…

> Yeah, used EVs depreciate quickly. Yeah, not sure about that. Currently, used Model 3 LR AWD from 2019 with around 10k-20k mileage go for just a few grand cheaper than what I bought it for (new) in 2019[0]. 0. https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/l-Used-2019-Tesla-Model-3-Long...

current used car market is supposedly historically high vs new - probably better to do a longer or earlier comparison before making conclusions, esp. if comparing a fairly new 'used' vehicle

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#135

Post by drexlspivey »

ars wrote: post #111
r00fus wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Norway has a sovereign wealth fund (valuation: 1.4T in USD) that is setup specifically for this eventuality. Many large oil exporting countries know the good times won't last, and are planning for it.

> Norway has a sovereign wealth fund (valuation: 1.4T in USD) that is setup specifically for this eventuality. That's not much - $25K per person over 10 years, and with an average income of $70K per person, and something like half of their economy is energy (most if not all social programs are funded from energy production). If oil were to stop tomorrow, they'd have around 10 years before the money runs out. (Maybe a…

it’s actually $250k per person

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#136

Post by mfer »

paultnylund wrote: post #107
mfer wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is Norway handling the increased use of the electric grid? I ask because Elon noted the US power grid needed to double output to handle a full is transition

Last I heard, they actually have so much excess power that they're selling it to the UK.

First, it’s great they have so much green power generation. I didn’t realize that.

In addition to generation there is local distribution. Power lines, transformers, etc. Is there any information on that part of it? I wonder if they needed to upgrade their grid.

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#137

Post by collegeburner »

njovin wrote: post #97
ostenning wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meanwhile in Australia: electric cars are getting taxed more to support the aging oil infrastructure

Similar in California and other states. The states typically tax gasoline and since electrics don't use any they are implementing special fees on electric vehicle purchases to make up for lost revenue. One would think that the savings in pollution (not only for the car itself, but the transport of the fuel, pollution from refineries, etc.) would offset any lost revenue from gas taxes. What makes this really nonsensic…

More the fact that many states fund road work with a gasoline tax, this makes sense since it's got a decent correlation on how much use somebody gets from the roads. Electrics don't do this so states will come up short as more electrics get adopted otherwise.

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#138

Post by anonporridge »

clouddrover wrote: post #130
anonporridge wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This makes me wonder if the Colonial Pipeline cyberattack indirectly led to an acceleration of EV adoption. All of these events make more and more people recognize the relative weakness and fragility of an oil based civilization compared to an electric one.

You can have equivalent cyberattacks on power stations and EV charging networks.

Of course. But a key difference is that the electric grid seems to be drastically more decentralized than fuel pipelines.

Pipelines for liquid or gaseous fuel have a huge upfront cost and maintenance requirements compared to running power lines, so the incentives are to build them as big as possible.

Taking down a power station is certainly a viable attack vector, but the damage caused by losing a single station is drastically more manageable than losing a key pipeline that a massive region of the continent needs to feed continuously from to keep civilization running.

This is not even accounting for the further decentralizing and ruggedizing effect that comes when every rooftop subsidizes their own energy needs with solar and batteries.

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#139

Post by plantain »

SomeCallMeTim wrote: post #114
njovin wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Similar in California and other states. The states typically tax gasoline and since electrics don't use any they are implementing special fees on electric vehicle purchases to make up for lost revenue. One would think that the savings in pollution (not only for the car itself, but the transport of the fuel, pollution from refineries, etc.) would offset any lost revenue from gas taxes. What makes this really nonsensic…

In Colorado at least it's not that high. $50 plus a small amount (today) that goes up over time to no more than $96 in the 2031-2032 fiscal year. It's CERTAINLY a lot less than you'd be paying in gas tax if you used your car an average amount. Taxes aren't punishment, anyway. Especially "road use taxes", which are, in this case, used to repair the roads you're driving on. [1] https://afdc.energy.gov/laws/11486

Taxes are a form of punishment, they're a tool to discourage certain behaviours relative to others.

Whether roads are funded by road taxes or primary school fees doesn't matter - if we want to promote a behaviour we subsidize it; if we want to discourage it, we tax it.

Whether and how the books balance in the background isn't relevant.

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#140

Post by nostromo »

njovin wrote: post #97
ostenning wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meanwhile in Australia: electric cars are getting taxed more to support the aging oil infrastructure

Similar in California and other states. The states typically tax gasoline and since electrics don't use any they are implementing special fees on electric vehicle purchases to make up for lost revenue. One would think that the savings in pollution (not only for the car itself, but the transport of the fuel, pollution from refineries, etc.) would offset any lost revenue from gas taxes. What makes this really nonsensic…

It should be based on weight, not the car’s value.

Most of the wear and tear on our roads come from trucks, not passenger cars.

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