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Group Video Calls

telegram.org

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Re: Group Video Calls

#131

Post by deadalus »

nucleardog wrote: post #101
ticviking wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TBH my threat model views Russian and Middle Eastern oligarchs and governments as less of an immediate threat to my freedoms than my own government or major US tech firms. Long run it's a problem, but until I have a app at the same risk/feature sweet spot I don't mind the downsides of telegram. (Edited cause I am utterly unable to spell)

This was part of how I settled on Telegram. Basically any western country can be secretly ordered to turn over all my information on the flimsiest of reasons, if it’s not already just intercepted through Five Eyes style arrangements. The chances of Russia volunteering to share my chat history with anyone that could actually impact my day to day life is pretty much nil, and I’m certainly not interesting to anyone in t…

This is also the reason I prefer using VPN based in countries that are NOT based in USA/EU and that are not friendly to USA/EU -> Russia, China, Myanmar, Iran etc.

Re: Group Video Calls

#132

Post by bhtru »

stereoradonc wrote: post #124
throwaway13337 wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Care to qualify that speculation with some evidence? It seems like whenever telegram is brought up here, there's a lot of speculation about it not being trustworthy but no concrete evidence. The client is open source. While not end to end encrypted by default, it shares that property with most messengers. E2E limits search-ability and other features so it's a tradeoff. I have to wonder if part of why this is mostly b…

I( completely agree with whatever you have listed here and the reason why the app is up for bashing is because of the antecedents of the owner. How does everything which has its origins in US is touched up with fairy duust while anything that may have a remote link with Russia is garbage? Signal is garbage. They are riding on the coattails of marketing (and that's what investment money does)

Care to elaborate why you believe Signal is garbage? Is it for technical reasons?

Re: Group Video Calls

#133

Post by risyachka »

qwertox wrote: post #34

To me Telegram feels like the red corner district of a city. I simply don't feel like I can trust it, there's something very shady about it. I wouldn't be surprised if Telegram reads those exclusive Bitcoin whale groups and uses that insider info. Group chats are not end to end encrypted. That being said, WhatsApp is like the authorized garage where you know that you'll get the service which is officially recognized…

None of the messengers except Signal give any confidence in being really private.

And when comparing Telegram and Whatsapp shady-wise, only one of them has obvious many reasons to track you as much as technically and legally possible.

And when it comes to app performance, UX and ease of use - Telegram beats all others with a huge margin.

Re: Group Video Calls

#134

Post by eitland »

HunOL wrote: post #114
eitland wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Without being able to audit their server though, we have no clue if 'disappeared' chats and messages are actually scrubbed from their server. Automatically disappearing messages are only available in "secret" chats and those are end-to-end encrypted.

There is possibility to set self-destruct timer for photos you send.

You are right. I forgot that. I guess that is not end-to-end encrypted in regular chats.

Re: Group Video Calls

#135

Post by playpause »

throwaway13337 wrote: post #119
qwertox wrote: post #34

To me Telegram feels like the red corner district of a city. I simply don't feel like I can trust it, there's something very shady about it. I wouldn't be surprised if Telegram reads those exclusive Bitcoin whale groups and uses that insider info. Group chats are not end to end encrypted. That being said, WhatsApp is like the authorized garage where you know that you'll get the service which is officially recognized…

Care to qualify that speculation with some evidence? It seems like whenever telegram is brought up here, there's a lot of speculation about it not being trustworthy but no concrete evidence. The client is open source. While not end to end encrypted by default, it shares that property with most messengers. E2E limits search-ability and other features so it's a tradeoff. I have to wonder if part of why this is mostly b…

> Care to qualify that speculation with some evidence?

This is a weird way to respond to someone using a metaphor to describe how an app makes them feel.

Re: Group Video Calls

#136

Post by temptemptemp111 »

qwertox wrote: post #34

To me Telegram feels like the red corner district of a city. I simply don't feel like I can trust it, there's something very shady about it. I wouldn't be surprised if Telegram reads those exclusive Bitcoin whale groups and uses that insider info. Group chats are not end to end encrypted. That being said, WhatsApp is like the authorized garage where you know that you'll get the service which is officially recognized…

All we need now is Durov to release telegram-server so we can self host like wire-server. Yes I realize it isn't federated, but this could massively help the FOSS community on a bunch of efforts. No excuse really. They can always do whatever internally with telegram-server and we'd be none-the-wiser... Even some extra obfuscation for security ;p

Re: Group Video Calls

#137

Post by aleksi »

playpause wrote: post #135
throwaway13337 wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Care to qualify that speculation with some evidence? It seems like whenever telegram is brought up here, there's a lot of speculation about it not being trustworthy but no concrete evidence. The client is open source. While not end to end encrypted by default, it shares that property with most messengers. E2E limits search-ability and other features so it's a tradeoff. I have to wonder if part of why this is mostly b…

> Care to qualify that speculation with some evidence? This is a weird way to respond to someone using a metaphor to describe how an app makes them feel.

> I wouldn't be surprised if Telegram reads those exclusive Bitcoin whale groups and uses that insider info.

That's not a metaphor, though.

Re: Group Video Calls

#138

Post by Popegaf »

decrypt wrote: post #108
0xy wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Telegram does have E2EE in secret chats. WhatsApp does NOT have E2EE because it backs up your private keys to cloud storage by default. Even if you don't, your contacts might. Therefore WhatsApp is less secure.

This is incorrect. WhatsApp is E2EE as well. It does not backup the keys to their cloud. Rather, you seem to be referring to the fact that they offer cloud backup on Google Drive, in which case the chats are stored in plain text.

You're being unnecessarily pedantic and not actually even refuting anything they said.

Using Whatsapp is like sending a locked chest to your friend and a copy thereof + a copy of the key to unlock it to a warehouse. Government employees and warehouse workers can enter the warehouse at will, use the key to open your chest, and copy everything too.

Nice lock.

Re: Group Video Calls

#139

Post by novok »

throwaway13337 wrote: post #119
qwertox wrote: post #34

To me Telegram feels like the red corner district of a city. I simply don't feel like I can trust it, there's something very shady about it. I wouldn't be surprised if Telegram reads those exclusive Bitcoin whale groups and uses that insider info. Group chats are not end to end encrypted. That being said, WhatsApp is like the authorized garage where you know that you'll get the service which is officially recognized…

Care to qualify that speculation with some evidence? It seems like whenever telegram is brought up here, there's a lot of speculation about it not being trustworthy but no concrete evidence. The client is open source. While not end to end encrypted by default, it shares that property with most messengers. E2E limits search-ability and other features so it's a tradeoff. I have to wonder if part of why this is mostly b…

Telegram is about as private as facebook messenger or discord is the basic assertion. FB messenger is a much nicer client than the more private chat messengers, but telegram is essentially a client you can't assume is private, much like FB messenger itself, even if it has an E2EE chat mode that nobody uses.

But people are deluded that it's as private as Signal or Matrix, which is laughable.

Re: Group Video Calls

#140

Post by novok »

nucleardog wrote: post #101
ticviking wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TBH my threat model views Russian and Middle Eastern oligarchs and governments as less of an immediate threat to my freedoms than my own government or major US tech firms. Long run it's a problem, but until I have a app at the same risk/feature sweet spot I don't mind the downsides of telegram. (Edited cause I am utterly unable to spell)

This was part of how I settled on Telegram. Basically any western country can be secretly ordered to turn over all my information on the flimsiest of reasons, if it’s not already just intercepted through Five Eyes style arrangements. The chances of Russia volunteering to share my chat history with anyone that could actually impact my day to day life is pretty much nil, and I’m certainly not interesting to anyone in t…

Secret 1:1 & group chat by default like signal, well labeled non-secret large chat rooms, open source clients and using standardized encryption and they'd do pretty well amongst the privacy crowd too.
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