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Early-Retirement Update

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Re: Early-Retirement Update

#131

Post by [deleted] »

pinkybanana wrote: post #84
lutorm wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except "retirement" simply means "not having to work to survive". It doesn't mean doing nothing, it means having the freedom to choose to do things that are meaningful to you.

In common language it doesn't. Many people who choose to work don't need the job to survive. I know ridiculously wealthy people who just keep working the usual way. No one says those people are retired. While retirement is cool, I think life goes better without thinking too much about it. Try to work at a job that doesn't suck ass, try to have hobbies and free time, focus on family etc, invest your savings, don't buy…

[deleted]

Re: Early-Retirement Update

#132

Post by kelnos »

sfblah wrote: post #111
neogodless wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even with the minor and major shocks in his life, he ended up with 20% more money than he started with. The main reason he wants more money now is that he wants to share it with his new partner, and enjoy some lifestyle inflation. So I don't think it makes sense to extrapolate "leanFIRE cannot sustain minor shocks" from his circumstances." It certainly cannot sustain a certain level of lifestyle inflation, or (more g…

The 20% gain is 100% a consequence of the Fed and the market mania. This experiment attempted in another 5-year span would have worked out totally differently.

OP addresses this. He points out that when he retired, one of his fears was that his nest egg was propped up by market mania. But since then his nest egg has increased. Sure, you can say it might have worked out differently in different time periods, but that's not necessarily a problem. The point of making these models before retiring is to also take into account the pessimistic conditions, and it appears he did so, and judged it all still possible.

Re: Early-Retirement Update

#134

Post by fuyu »

ericmay wrote: post #13

To me the emphasis on the FIRE community should be on the FI part of the equation. For many people in many countries, there is no concept of "retirement". It seems so silly to me that people would go and say "I'll work really hard and do all this stuff for 40 years so I can sit around and do nothing for another 30 years". What's the point? It's unsustainable. It's like doing a crash diet - it may work for a minute, b…

Wanting to spend more time doing things such and volunteering or gardening are exactly reasons why someone might pursue early retirement. It sounds like you agree with the concept but are getting distracted by terminology.

Re: Early-Retirement Update

#135

Post by [deleted] »

eagsalazar2 wrote: post #120
dimmke wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've had friends with trust funds, who just seem to dither around in life. "Making music" they never release. Picking up little "pass the time" jobs. And these are people that aren't living "leanFIRE" It seems like such a nihilistic way to live. You're just floating along the stream of life. Things worked out for you, but you have no further passion or inclination to improve the world? No problems you could set yours…

Not just FIRE people, but 99% of all retirees at any age end up doing nothing of note with their time. But, and I think you aren't saying otherwise, this is also true of everyone who still has to work, while they are working. Your job is just the thing you have to do (if you are lucky you actually enjoy it). Bottom line, most people don't actually have a purpose or strong passions in their lives. Being retired young…

[deleted]

Re: Early-Retirement Update

#136

Post by kelnos »

hogFeast wrote: post #89
regularfry wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not "doing nothing" it's "choosing to do nothing for anyone else", which is very different.

It is the same. What is the point of being alive if you aren't providing value to other people? Just sitting on your mountain of gold, and count it all day long.

If that's your view of early retirement (or retirement in general), you are very very mistaken.

There can be more to life than working for a paycheck, regardless of what we've been socially conditioned to believe from childhood.

Re: Early-Retirement Update

#137

Post by GordonS »

eagsalazar2 wrote: post #120
dimmke wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've had friends with trust funds, who just seem to dither around in life. "Making music" they never release. Picking up little "pass the time" jobs. And these are people that aren't living "leanFIRE" It seems like such a nihilistic way to live. You're just floating along the stream of life. Things worked out for you, but you have no further passion or inclination to improve the world? No problems you could set yours…

Not just FIRE people, but 99% of all retirees at any age end up doing nothing of note with their time. But, and I think you aren't saying otherwise, this is also true of everyone who still has to work, while they are working. Your job is just the thing you have to do (if you are lucky you actually enjoy it). Bottom line, most people don't actually have a purpose or strong passions in their lives. Being retired young…

> Not just FIRE people, but 99% of all retirees at any age end up doing nothing of note with their time.

If you spend some years just chilling and and are actually happy, then sure, why not. But there are so many retired people who do nothing, and are not happy.

For example, my mother, my mother and father in law, my other father in law, my grandmother - all retired, and all do absolutely nothing but watch TV and moan about other people all day. And they are all very obviously not happy, yet suggestions for things to do or get involved in always fall in deaf ears - they'd apparently rather sit and do nothing until they die.

I really, really don't get it.

Re: Early-Retirement Update

#138

Post by zippergz »

mcguire wrote: post #85
eric_b wrote: post #46

I really struggled with the author's tone. It dripped of condescension towards those who live a "normal" lifestyle. I enjoy working. I find purpose and meaning it. I do not let it dominate my life, but without it I would feel incomplete. I run my own business now, and that is very satisfying - but even when I was a corporate consultant I found a lot of enjoyment from spending time with my coworkers, solving problems,…

" ...she had acquired, somehow, New Life Dreams, which had to do with Conspicuous Consumption and Keeping Up and being Visibly Awesome... " I was thinking the same thing: geeze, isn't there anything between virtue signalling early retirement and conspicuous consumption?

This aspect was so frustrating to me. He's far too dismissive of the reasons people spend money and buy things.

Yes, some people spend money on Louis Vuitton bags and fancy cars to show off. But other things people spend money on do legitimately make their life better, more comfortable, or happier. A house in a quieter neighborhood helps me sleep better. A bigger house, where my spouse and I can each have our private space helps our relationship. Clothes that fit well make me more comfortable. A reliable car makes my life less stressful. Are these things "keeping up" or "conspicuous consumption" just because I was not absolutely required to buy them? Is my partner a bad person if she'd rather have a quiet hotel room than stay in a hostel?

I do think that it's worthwhile to be introspective about how you spend your money, and if the things you're spending your money on actually do make you happier. But this black and white thinking is really counterproductive.

Re: Early-Retirement Update

#140

Post by ed25519FUUU »

AlwaysRock wrote: post #108
dimmke wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've had friends with trust funds, who just seem to dither around in life. "Making music" they never release. Picking up little "pass the time" jobs. And these are people that aren't living "leanFIRE" It seems like such a nihilistic way to live. You're just floating along the stream of life. Things worked out for you, but you have no further passion or inclination to improve the world? No problems you could set yours…

I don't know. I'd love to have a basic level of income and then be able to dither around with random jobs. I'd love to be a bartender for 6 months, work in a bookstore for 6 months, become a carpenter for a year or two. I'd probably feel differently if I actually had a trust fund since my upbringing would be different but it does feel stifling that in order to have a financially rewarding career one has to stay on a…

You can do that now. Why not? Bartenders make okay money, and you wouldn’t have to compete with like-minded people like if there was BI.
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