Female Founder Secrets: Fertility • Hacker News Board

Re: Female Founder Secrets: Fertility

#131

Post by munificent » Thu, Mar 04, 2021, 6:47 PM UTC

smoldesu wrote: post #14

And people wonder why the birth rate is continuing to decline. Our nation-wide workaholism is making family life an increasingly distant fantasy. I've had this discussion with my S/O before, and we've always come to the same conclusion: it would be irresponsible for us to adopt while both of us are working. That's a difficult place to be in, considering we're both quite passionate about our jobs. It makes me quite de…

> it would be irresponsible for us to adopt while both of us are working.

You are falling into the classic nerd trap which is doing an absolute evaluation when you should be making a relative comparison.

The question is not, "Can I raise this adopted child in the optimal way?" The question is, "Will I raise this child at least as good as the other parents they are likely to end up with instead?"

It's not like if you don't adopt them they get whisked away to a magical realm populated full of only perfect parents. Also, your parents weren't perfect but you probably turned out OK.

Re: Female Founder Secrets: Fertility

#132

Post by sct202 » Thu, Mar 04, 2021, 6:47 PM UTC

mberning wrote: post #8

I just recently had my first at an age closer to 40 than 30. I think freezing your eggs and having kids later is not such a great idea. Sure, you can have the kid well outside your prime or even use a surrogate. But that is just the beginning. Your child is not going to get the experience of being raised by a more youthful and energetic version of yourself . I think there is a lot to be said for that. I wish I had st…

I have older parents who had me at 40, and I wouldn't feel guilty over it if I were you. I didn't really realize how much older my parents were than a lot of other people's until I went to college.

Re: Female Founder Secrets: Fertility

#133

Post by endisneigh » Thu, Mar 04, 2021, 6:48 PM UTC

dcow wrote: post #116

I think women have largely been presented a false promise by progressives: value and purpose is derived from work, go do what men do to be their equal. It’s not necessarily anybody’s fault, we live in a society where money is valued. But I wish we could structure society in a way such that the value of raising children, homemaking, is clearly communicated and understood. Being a mother without a snazzy career is frow…

I couldn't agree more. I've been wondering if we're moving further or closer to the ideal you describe. As more excluded groups move towards unfettered capitalism, I wonder if we'll be lift with a huge gap to fill in the "bleeding heart" jobs, e.g. being a home maker, social worker, etc.

Re: Female Founder Secrets: Fertility

#134

Post by mbgerring » Thu, Mar 04, 2021, 6:49 PM UTC

In the United States, it's economically difficult verging on impossible for young people to have and raise children. Between the increasing costs of housing, childcare, and education, it shouldn't surprise anyone that more and more people are putting off starting a family until they're able to earn and save a substantial amount of money. That leads people like the author of this post to the very rational decision to delay pregnancy. If you want a society where people are practically free to start a family instead of putting everything they have into earning money, you need to fix things up from the material conditions, not down from the culture.

Re: Female Founder Secrets: Fertility

#135

Post by rcpt » Thu, Mar 04, 2021, 6:49 PM UTC

dheera wrote: post #32

rantwasp wrote: post #3

I empathize with how hard it is for a female founder in particular and for a woman in general when it comes to mixing children with a career. That said the advice to freeze your eggs (ie work now, live later) rubs me the wrong way. I wish we could live in a society where people would not have to work themselves to death and were able to... you know... enjoy life

Potentially controversial thought here, but I'd like to bring it up for discussion. I feel like the work ethic I see throughout the industry is extremely toxic to society, and leads to some of this. In China for example there's a so-called "996" work schedule (9am-9pm, 6 days a week) which is basically expected of everyone in tech, unfortunately, and it seems Silicon Valley is heading that direction as well with all…

I don't think I've known anyone who worked a 996 or regular 70 hour weeks. Where are you seeing this?

Re: Female Founder Secrets: Fertility

#136

Post by mbgerring » Thu, Mar 04, 2021, 6:49 PM UTC

dcow wrote: post #116

I think women have largely been presented a false promise by progressives: value and purpose is derived from work, go do what men do to be their equal. It’s not necessarily anybody’s fault, we live in a society where money is valued. But I wish we could structure society in a way such that the value of raising children, homemaking, is clearly communicated and understood. Being a mother without a snazzy career is frow…

I think the economics of raising children plays a much greater role than stigma or culture.

Re: Female Founder Secrets: Fertility

#137

Post by austincheney » Thu, Mar 04, 2021, 6:50 PM UTC

dcow wrote: post #116

I think women have largely been presented a false promise by progressives: value and purpose is derived from work, go do what men do to be their equal. It’s not necessarily anybody’s fault, we live in a society where money is valued. But I wish we could structure society in a way such that the value of raising children, homemaking, is clearly communicated and understood. Being a mother without a snazzy career is frow…

Actually, why must the family homemaker necessarily be a woman? If in a male/female relationship the female is the more ambitious one prioritize the male as the primary care giver. Either way raising children still takes time, energy, and focus that could otherwise pile into something else.

While there are differences in general approaches males and females take in raising children I don't think there is any research indicating females are necessarily better than males, or the contrary. The reductio ad absurdum of it is that males tend to be more challenging and females tend to be nurturing, but those distinctions are highly variable.

Re: Female Founder Secrets: Fertility

#138

Post by llimos » Thu, Mar 04, 2021, 6:50 PM UTC

dcow wrote: post #116

I think women have largely been presented a false promise by progressives: value and purpose is derived from work, go do what men do to be their equal. It’s not necessarily anybody’s fault, we live in a society where money is valued. But I wish we could structure society in a way such that the value of raising children, homemaking, is clearly communicated and understood. Being a mother without a snazzy career is frow…

1000% this.

> Why do women have to emulate men to be valuable?

Growing up in a "traditional" family, the first thing that struck me when I went to work at a big investment bank was how the women did everything they could to be like men - all the way down to dress. I remember thinking, this is called equality? That what men traditionally did is clearly so much better, so women now need to become men, and we should celebrate the achievement that they are now free to do so?

I mean, yes, obviously if they want to, the fact that they can is a good thing. But the fact that they almost need to, is not.

Re: Female Founder Secrets: Fertility

#139

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Mar 04, 2021, 6:50 PM UTC

jurassic wrote: post #130

I feel like the moonshot or bust VC startup mindset is the problem here. The startup fantasy is that you're going to take investment to build a multi-billion dollar company. But most people don't need anything close to a billion dollars to do everything they want in life, so it's unfortunate that many peoples' idea of entrepreneurship is tangled up in this unicorn playbook. This version of entrepreneurship is just a…

[deleted]

Re: Female Founder Secrets: Fertility

#140

Post by vmception » Thu, Mar 04, 2021, 6:50 PM UTC

dcow wrote: post #116

I think women have largely been presented a false promise by progressives: value and purpose is derived from work, go do what men do to be their equal. It’s not necessarily anybody’s fault, we live in a society where money is valued. But I wish we could structure society in a way such that the value of raising children, homemaking, is clearly communicated and understood. Being a mother without a snazzy career is frow…

> Being a mother without a snazzy career is frowned upon by plenty of people these days. I don't think that stigma is healthy. Why do women have to emulate men to be valuable?

I used to think that, but then I found out that many people aren't trying to emulate men, they are trying to do a more encompassing thing, juggling an unprecedented number of roles and responsibilities surpassing what has been human in nature.

So, basically, even worse than emulating men.

My observation is that a lot of this is based on an assumption that men want to be in corporate careers. As in, pursuing a corporate/intellectual blue collar or white collar career is not an optional checkbox of pride for men that want to exchange time for food and shelter and have a female partner. I think if this was acknowledged for how it is interdependent in the state of the world it would help even out representation and many other strifes, as opposed to gendering the problems and invalidating problems based on priority.