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Why blockchain is not yet working (2018)

as1ndu.xyz

131–140 of 330 posts

Re: Why blockchain is not yet working (2018)

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The house I'm in was financed by my wife and I purchasing a plot of land, for cash, then offering that land as security to a bank, who then created a loan for a fairly sizable chunk of cash with which we paid a builder to construct the house. This begs the obvious question: contract law is all about enforcement. Clearly no one would be right to dispute you own this land and home, you have the deeds and the tax hist…

> help create an automated arbitration system, divorced entirely from the whims of Mankind No. That is simply not possible with anything resembling today's technology. We'll have flying cars on a Mars city before automated arbitration on real world matters. > help build the future we all want and maybe have a chance of creating a post-scarce World. Except fixed supply currency is going back in the other direction. An…

> No. That is simply not possible with anything resembling today's technology. We'll have flying cars on a Mars city before automated arbitration on real world matters.

I don't disagree about its current feasibility, but I think that's mainly so because of a distortion of incentives and that so many are invested in this model (the few) despite how horrible it is (to the detriment of the many) as so many people are incapable of doing anything else at this point.

They would sooner die than consider opting for something that they know will end their way of life if successful and this terrifies them rather than excites them about starting something new in life; the sad reality is the legal system is already getting disrupted as we speak all over the World and it's innovating at the edges, but also manifests as distrust and disillusionment and lost of confidence in even basic things like anti-masker, vaccine conspiracy, and refusing to follow curfew and business closures and can lead to having the National Gaurd in Washington DC due to the storming of the Capital by imbeciles fomented by Trump.

All of these are legal matters that are complicated and messy, without a doubt, but the current legal system is to blame for why so many loss confidence as it cannot solve them either, and we can easily be overrun with a 'burning of Alexandria' situation if we don't attempt to solve these problems. And I mean in the next decade given how fast things are escalating not just in the West but in Asia: Thailand, Hong Kong and Mynmar are all in revolt right now for obvious break down in trust with thier systems and legal systems. The CCP is the benefactor from these disolving in the region as they can expand their influence in the turmoil and they simply don't care how corrupt their legal systems are or how they appear to the outside World and will disappear you if you resist which is where I think this is all heading.

> Except fixed supply currency is going back in the other direction. And the hard parts about eliminating scarcity have nothing to do with the monetary system.

WHAT?!!!

This smacks of outright detached privilege only HNers can conjure up from its ivory tower, go to countries that suffer from hyperinflation and still suffer from severe capital controls after that period all of which prevent wealth creation before you make such a claim.

Otherwise I cannot take you seriously as your ignorance is almost palpably painful to me... I've lived and worked in Eastern Europe in the last decade and I went to baja before the revaluation of the peso in the 90s quite often as tourists, and the amount of poverty is incredibly sad... it was crazy to see how my single dollar bill bought 1000s worth of X in pesos down there. I honestly would buy absurd stuff like 10kg of packaged laundry detergent because it cost something absurd like 96 cents and I had a story to tell when I got back to school.

Ill still remember to this day how upset I felt as a kid using quarters on the arcade machines outside the store instead of going to the counter and exchanging my USD to credits for 'free play' tokens, and then suddenly realizing how spoiled I was and how the $10 I spent in that store after a few hours probably helped feed the owners entire family for a week. It's funny how much those experiences make you grow up, and I fear you cannot relate.

What you have just said is just beyond belief and I cannot seriously take what you say serious.

I can address lending as that is already a thing, BTC is the collateral and fiat is the lent out. But the short is we just revert to a satoshi standard rather than whole Bitcoin (satoshi is 100 millionth of a Bitcoin)... But I seriously don't feel like I can muster the energy to go into depth as to how that would look like because of how struck I am by that statement.

I'm not trying to be a SJW trigger queen, but that is just so painfully ignorant that my head literately hurts now and I have to get offline for a while.

Re: Why blockchain is not yet working (2018)

#132

The "lack of intuitive private key management" is worth expanding on. Would it not be nice if you could, maybe for a small fee, have some trusted entity store your private key for you? One could perhaps imagine storing a printout of the private key in some kind of physical "safe deposit" box, to be maintained by such an entity? But maybe that is to cumbersome and we can do so entirely digitally? In that case I guess…

Key escrow is already a thing. I recently helped a friend recover his wallet, and luckily he had his private key escrowed.

Re: Why blockchain is not yet working (2018)

#133
post #54

I think the #1 reason blockchain doesn't work is very simple - the technology is broken beyond fixability. This article is two years old, but the same variations of these excuses always come up when the crypto ideologues are grilled on why their utopiaic vision hasn't come about, for all of blockchain's existence. Blockchain is awful for most things compared to a centralized or distributed database: it is inefficient…

> the technology is broken beyond fixability [citation needed] Crypto ideologues are a strawman. Anyone working on the actual tech agrees that blockchains are useful if, and only if, you can't rely on a single party and need a decentralized, trustless append-only database. Otherwise, why bother with the extra complexity? That's the whole point of blockchains, after all. Technology choices are complex set of trade-off…

Blockchain is like NoSQL.

NoSQL was a nice buzzword to bunch up web caches and log processing tools for analytics, especially for the creepy-spying-ads corps.

The blockchain niches seem to be much, much smaller than what it's sold for. Once the dust settles (~5 years from now) it's likely that not much will be left behind an all this money spent on it will have been wasted.

Heck, NoSQL databases have wider applicability than blockchain and few people consider them a major technological revolution, let alone a social or economical one.

Re: Why blockchain is not yet working (2018)

#134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Until you need international remittances or business payments. Then, Crypto at its worst is far better than international Wire Transfers, etc.

Better than, say, Transferwise or XE.com? Can you explain how?

There isn’t a list of allowed vs banned countries?

Re: Why blockchain is not yet working (2018)

#135
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin has all of the problems listed in the article and is, arguably, not yet providing the social value that blockchain could. Not sure how a high market cap is a counter argument to that.

The market cap is a counter argument because it shows the trust people, and lately corporations put into Bitcoin as a store of wealth and a hedge against inflation. The market cap proves that bitcoin/blockchain/cryptocurrency enthusiasts put their money where their mouth is.

> The market cap is a counter argument because it shows the trust people

See also Enron, WorldCom, Nortel, Bre-X (for the Canadians out there).

> […] and lately corporations put into Bitcoin as a store of wealth and a hedge against inflation.

Given its volatility, I'm not sure how useful it is as a store of wealth. Less than a year ago it lost half its value in two days (before the recent run-up):

* https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/13/bitcoin-loses-half-of-its-va...

If you think inflation is coming, then you need to stop working in economics and/or finance, as you're burning up returns hedging against it, at least in the US/industrialized world. The last time it was a problem was >40 years ago (mostly due to OPEC):

* https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/FPCPITOTLZGUSA

Outside of specific circumstance, deflation is the predominant force:

> But Inflation is not inevitable. There are numerous countervailing forces that have been at work for much of the past 50 years. The three big Deflation drivers: 1) Technology, which creates massive economies of scale, especially in digital products (e.g., Software); 2) Robotics/Automation, which efficiently create more physical goods at lower prices; and 3) Globalization and Labor Arbitrage, which sends work to lower cost regions, making goods and services less expensive.

> Put into this context, Inflation is periodic, driven by specific events; Deflation is consistent, the background state of the modern economy. To fully understand this requires grasping how scarcity and abundance act as the drivers of the price of labor and goods. My suspicion is many economists who came of age during earlier eras of inflation fail to discern how the world has changed since.

* https://ritholtz.com/2021/02/stop-stressing-about-inflation/

Re: Why blockchain is not yet working (2018)

#136

I think the #1 reason blockchain doesn't work is very simple - the technology is broken beyond fixability. This article is two years old, but the same variations of these excuses always come up when the crypto ideologues are grilled on why their utopiaic vision hasn't come about, for all of blockchain's existence. Blockchain is awful for most things compared to a centralized or distributed database: it is inefficient…

I have been in the blockchain space for about three years, and there is an explosion in tech and innovation in the last six months. Visa, Mastercard etc... are integrating, bank regulators now allow banks to connect to public networks. It just astounds me sometimes how people can be so confident in a review of a platform type and done so little research. I urge you to take a second look. Blockchain is primed to disrupt the financial industry.

Re: Why blockchain is not yet working (2018)

#137
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the typical argument on a very technical board such as HN where blockchain is synonymous with a specific implementation. But that's an outdated way to think about blockchains. Yes, Bitcoin's implementation is a huge resource hog and slow. But for most newer projects "blockchain" just means an auditable trail of state changes. Whether you implement this with the shiniest newest db paradigm or some simple SQL d…

> But for most newer projects "blockchain" just means an auditable trail of state changes. you mean, the 1979-model Merkle tree? I concur that in a lot of marketed "blockchains", the closest to a useful bit is the 1979-model Merkle tree.

Even more trivial, single-leaf Merkle trees is all that is needed.

Re: Why blockchain is not yet working (2018)

#138
A big part of why crypto doesn't work in my opinion is that it's hard to trust software and hardware with your money when you don't own the hardware or software or can't modify it freely. Nation-states take great care to ensure that you don't have exclusive rights to the things and therefore your entire life savings could vanish in the blink of an eye without so much as any guarantee of getting your value back. State backed fiat currency is by far still more valuable than crypto and the proof is self evident at this point.

Re: Why blockchain is not yet working (2018)

#139
post #110

I think price volatility is the only reason it's not working as a normal currency. Right now, these blockchain currencies are traded just like expensive wine, art or gold bar. It's a speculative money game. We can't use wine or art to buy some food for today. Most people don't even run the full node themselves. They relies on somebody else's node. In good term, they are investing, in other words, they are gambling. I…

You have obviously no idea what you're talking about. Bitcoin's block mining algorithm is excessively deflationary: it encourages hoarding instead of spending while disproportionately rewarding early adopters. That however has absolutely nothing whatsoever todo with the blockchain algorithm, which was/is truly innovative as a decentralized ledger.

There is nothing preventing cryptocurrencies from utilizing blockchain technology in combination with inflationary currency generating models, and in fact plenty of them do. They are less well known partially because they were later to the game, and partially because they lack the get-rich-quick pump and dump appeal of bitcoin and co.

Re: Why blockchain is not yet working (2018)

#140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> help create an automated arbitration system, divorced entirely from the whims of Mankind No. That is simply not possible with anything resembling today's technology. We'll have flying cars on a Mars city before automated arbitration on real world matters. > help build the future we all want and maybe have a chance of creating a post-scarce World. Except fixed supply currency is going back in the other direction. An…

> No. That is simply not possible with anything resembling today's technology. We'll have flying cars on a Mars city before automated arbitration on real world matters. I don't disagree about its current feasibility, but I think that's mainly so because of a distortion of incentives and that so many are invested in this model (the few) despite how horrible it is (to the detriment of the many) as so many people are in…

> I don't disagree about its current feasibility, but I think that's mainly so because of a distortion of incentives and that so many are invested in this model (the few) despite how horrible it is (to the detriment of the many) as so many people are incapable of doing anything else at this point.

The problem is, at this point it's like arguing for communism. It's an utopia. It could happen but I wouldn't bet money I'd lose sleep over on it.

It's probably more likely that an asteroid will hit the planet and we'll all go extinct before you're able to change the minds of most of humanity.

Heck, communists even managed to get a hold of a global superpower which actually tried to take over the world and they still lost! Good luck with Bitcoin/cryptocurrencies :-)

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