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Signal WhatsApp Chats Import

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Re: Signal WhatsApp Chats Import

#131

Post by gomox »

OkGoDoIt wrote: post #115
xrisk wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Off-topic but does Signal support independent multi-device yet? Sorry I can’t find reliable information about it online!

Nope, and that’s the biggest blocker for me. I own multiple smart phones (work and personal), iPad, and two computers (windows and Mac). So far Facebook messenger is the only reliable way to do messaging across all of them, which is a shame because I hate Facebook and I don’t particularly like messenger. But I have not found a single other solution that works cross-device and cross-platform. It also helps that basica…

Telegram

Re: Signal WhatsApp Chats Import

#132

Post by godelski »

tony101 wrote: post #122
jonahx wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't take notes of IRL conversation I have, they're ephemeral. Fairer analogy: If you could search transcripts of your IRL conversations at no additional cost (no notetaking), would you? I think most people would say yes.

That is a liability. Imagine if every word you have ever uttered to anyone is permanently recorded and can be used against you any time in the future, forever.

Take Twitter and remove even more context from a 10 year old comment.

Re: Signal WhatsApp Chats Import

#133

Post by FalconSensei »

izacus wrote: post #46
_l4jh wrote: post #19

I have been using Signal for two years now and I love it. However I really, really hope they can work on a good backup and restore process as losing my message history because I have to reinstall the app on my desktop[1] or have to reset my phone is a horrible experience. Just build an encrypted blob and zip it up and pop it on my iCloud or Google Drive or leave it local and let me deal with it but I need something .…

> However I really, really hope they can work on a good backup and restore process as losing my message history because I have to reinstall the app on my desktop[1] or have to reset my phone is a horrible experience. I've tried to report bugs and talk to developers about this but there's one fundamental problem here - the Signal team fundamentally does not value chat history the same way a lot of people do. They thin…

> the Signal team fundamentally does not value chat history the same way a lot of people do

This is the core problem as why many projects don't get mainstream. They have 2 options: they can focus on what they think is a priority, or on what the public thinks is a priority.

I'm not saying Signal is wrong on doing what they are doing, as they are being successful among some niches (i.e: tech). But to grab Whatsapp users, they need feature and UX parity, at least to some level

Re: Signal WhatsApp Chats Import

#134

Post by godelski »

smarx007 wrote: post #11
sjaak wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is keeping a chat history important? I don't take notes of IRL conversation I have, they're ephemeral. Not trolling, honestly curious :-)

I actually try to take paper notes of almost all IRL/online meetings I take part in :)

Serious question, really? Like when you're just having beers with your friends? Why? Does it make your friends feel uncomfortable? What's the benefit to you?

Re: Signal WhatsApp Chats Import

#135

Post by FalconSensei »

hackmiester wrote: post #125
jolmg wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

s/specific messages/& and conversations/ > I don't understand why people want to save their whole chat history Valuable messages and conversations can happen too often that it's a hassle to save them manually. This is probably more common in group chats where lots of people occasionally share valuable stuff.

Your point and use case are valid but unrelated. I agree with the parent comment but not with your sentiment.

The thing is: your use case and wants seems to be different than like, 90% of Whatsapp users, as they expect to never lose their history. So... Signal is not a replacement to Whatsapp

Re: Signal WhatsApp Chats Import

#136

Post by FalconSensei »

mandelbrotwurst wrote: post #114
verytrivial wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a bit of a cart before the horse issue, no? I mean what is the point of obsessing about the security of the messages if you don't value the messages themselves? Some people[1] clearly value message history far beyond the transfer point to chat itself, and making people choose between being spied upon and not having message history, I think many people will choose trusting that they won't lose their messages. [1]…

There is still value in being able to securely communicate in the present even if you are not able to maintain a permanently searchable log of all activity.

There's value, that's why some niches migrated to Signal.

But the general population seems to think they are losing features, instead of gaining, that's why they don't migrate/are upset and surprised when they lose history

Re: Signal WhatsApp Chats Import

#137

Post by juniperplant »

plibither8 wrote: post #21
soneca wrote: post #15

It is cool that this exists, but losing WhatsApp chat history is common enough (changing from Android to iOS, failing to keep backup up to date then buying new phone, losing, having it stolen, etc) that I don’t think it is a relevant barrier for changing apps.

I seriously can't understand why a billion dollar company with hundreds of engineers can't and won't prioritize the abilitynto seamlessly transfer messages cross-OS. Its been years since the need for such a "feature", when it shouldn't even be a "feature" in the first place, it should be baked in!

There's even a third-party software that is able to do this: https://www.backuptrans.com/android-whatsapp-to-iphone-trans...

I've used it myself.

Re: Signal WhatsApp Chats Import

#138

Post by Ericson2314 »

upofadown wrote: post #79
izacus wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> However I really, really hope they can work on a good backup and restore process as losing my message history because I have to reinstall the app on my desktop[1] or have to reset my phone is a horrible experience. I've tried to report bugs and talk to developers about this but there's one fundamental problem here - the Signal team fundamentally does not value chat history the same way a lot of people do. They thin…

>...the Signal team fundamentally does not value chat history the same way a lot of people do. Keeping around old messages more or less negates the value of forward secrecy. The Signal Protocol is obsessively forward secret. So it would be reasonable for those that have put so much work into getting rid of old messages for good would not value them.

Well then forward secrecy gets sacrificed for the greater good. Too bad!

Make a setting for those that care. Make it the responsibility of users to make sure all their devices agree on that setting. See? problem solved.

Re: Signal WhatsApp Chats Import

#139

Post by FalconSensei »

tw04 wrote: post #113
herbstein wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Signal protocol is forward-secret. I don't know the nitty-gritty specifics of the protocol, but the essence is this: You don't want someone getting access to your account two years from now to be able to access every old message. Consider every message a separate object that gets encrypted. The keys are changed/updated each time a new device is added to an account. That new device only knows the new key(s), and t…

>You don't want someone getting access to your account two years from now to be able to access every old message. The messages I don't want people getting ahold of are either created with expirations or I manually delete them. I couldn't care less if someone 2 years from now can read a chat log between me and my mom if it means that I can actually read them 2 years and multiple devices away from now as well. What I d…

Completely agree with that.

This whole 'I don't care about history' discourse can change greatly for some people after a loved one dies, for example.

Re: Signal WhatsApp Chats Import

#140

Post by pgalvin »

tony101 wrote: post #121
parliament32 wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would you want this? You don't save history for other types of chats, like in person conversations or phone calls (even though you could, with your phone recording in your pocket or call recorder apps). If something important comes up, like an address or recipe, copy/paste it into your notes app. Otherwise set your messages to expire after a month and be done with it. I used to be a message-hoarder too, but I rec…

Exactly. Keeping message history is a liability. There is no need to keep all old messages beyond one week. If there is something specific worth saving, there are apps for taking/pasting notes.

I can think of many reasons full message history is valuable.

- a friend says something that you don’t realise is important until months later and need to reference

- a friend or partner dies and you wish to revisit old times by reading your messages

- a couple wish to nostalgically re-read random conversations from their early time together

- a group chat for work or students shares valuable resources that you wish to reference, but is impractical to make copies of the dozens of messages

- legal reasons if somebody accused you of saying or doing something you did not do

- you’re going to an address (for example) that somebody sent you a week prior, but you forgot to save it

People are forgetful, people are emotional and nostalgic, and people are argumentative. All very good reasons for a chat history. Disappearing messages are simply always opt-in precisely because most people do not want it.

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