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Worms Armageddon 3.8

worms2d.info

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Re: Worms Armageddon 3.8

#131

Post by CyberShadow »

akdor1154 wrote: post #114
CyberShadow wrote: post #6

Worms Armageddon maintainer here, AMA :) Here is a somewhat more nicely formatted list of highlights: https://worms2d.info/Worms_Armageddon_3.8_Features

Why are you keeping compatibility with old versions of Windows? Is this a directive from T17? Your own interest? A good way of targeting Wine compatibility? Some other reason? Genuinely interested, not passing judgement on your priorities. :)

1. Because it's not very difficult to avoid breaking compatibility; 2. Because we don't want to invalidate the original system requirements.

Re: Worms Armageddon 3.8

#132

Post by russellendicott »

jcelerier wrote: post #124
tgsovlerkhgsel wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for keeping such an old game alive and awesome! Slightly offtopic: I haven't played Armageddon for a long time, but I assume the pace of Worms Armageddon is similar to Worms W.M.D. (which I'm playing on Switch), and it seems like there is a lot of waiting involved - just a few seconds here and there, but overall, it feels like the game could move at a much faster pace, especially when playing single player.…

If you want a non turn based version look up Liero (OpenLieroX). Gigantic amounts of fun to be had.

Love Liero. Never could get into Worms turn based because I started with Liero.

Re: Worms Armageddon 3.8

#133

Post by styfle »

I used to play Worms Armageddon back in the day and picked up Worms 3D a few years later. The 2D version always had a special place in my heart but I must have lost the CD-ROM over the years.

It’s exciting to see this game is still worked on, I’ll have to dust off the old PC and try it out again!

I noticed there is a version for iOS—will iOS also get the update?

Re: Worms Armageddon 3.8

#134

Post by zVirtu »

CyberShadow wrote: post #98
typh00n wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for your work and love on Worms Armageddon. The latest patch is bringing my favourite gamemode "multishot boomrace" to worms armageddon natively. :-) Is there something like a "roadmap", which things you want to tackle for future updates? (if there are any planed at all, since this is done in your free-time and the last patch was 2013) Because my oldschool and nostalgic memories are about worms world party…

If you ask us, "Do you want to improve X?", of course we will say yes. I think Project X (a powerful but sadly unmaintained third-party scripting mod for the game) has shown us a glimpse of what the culmination of the game's development might look like, so that's the direction that we want to go. Games with powerful modding capabilities (Garry's Mod, Skyrim) very often outlive the more static linear games, and combin…

Couldn't agree more. A Project X-like framework for scripting is capable of extending a game's lifetime in proportion to the involvement of its community, which is fortunately abundant in W:A's case.

In the same vein, the new schema format with Rubberworm capabilities was definitely a game changer. There's something so exciting about user-generated content officially making it into a base game. Thank you for making this possible!

But most importantly, it seems you guys have enough freedom to work on these sort of new features as much as the usual quality of life/bugfix changes.

How open is Team17 to these more intricate changes, especially towards the modding capabilities dream?

Re: Worms Armageddon 3.8

#135

Post by blaser-waffle »

Polylactic_acid wrote: post #102
striking wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wine's the best you're going to get here, probably for a long time. And it works really, really well. It even works under Wayland, which is not the case for a whole lot of games in Wine. Buy it on Steam, hit Play, enjoy. Seriously.

Proton is at the point where its almost better than native. Worms W.M.D has a native linux version but it only works properly on ubuntu due to some weird library issue. Some people suggest playing the windows version in proton is easier than getting the linux version to work.

I don't know if it's better than native, but Proton is certainly very good.

The only reason I kept a (personal use) Windows system was to play games; WINE and Proton are mature enough that I can run pretty much everything and ditched Windows about a year ago.

Re: Worms Armageddon 3.8

#136

Post by grawprog »

kristofferR wrote: post #100
grawprog wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for keeping worms Armageddon alive. It's still my favourite worms game by far. >Worms Armageddon now runs well under Wine or Proton on Linux. Was wondering if there would ever be a chance of a true native linux port? I've got one of the later worms games natively on linux, but it sort of pales in comparison to worms Armageddon and while I appreciate the efforts of the proton maintainers and Devs like yourself…

Why? As long as it works flawlessly and performant it shouldn't matter.

Not in regards to worms specifically, but, because at that point I'm paying the same price for a product that will always be treated as second class in regards to support and just about everything else. At any point the deveoper could decide to stop supporting proton and unlike with a native linux port, like with rocket league recently, if that happens I'm shit out of luck, at least with a native port, there's a chance of a refund if they drop support. Even steam's policies states that refunds should not be used for testing proton comparability with games.

If I'm going to be a paying customer, I'd prefer to be treated like all the rest of them.

Re: Worms Armageddon 3.8

#138

Post by folknor »

CyberShadow wrote: post #65
cycloptic wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the first point: If the assumption is that some community members are interested in developing cheats, would it not also make sense to assume that some community members are instead interested in hardening the netcode and developing anti-cheat systems? On the second point: Please have the powers-that-be consider doing a partial release of the parts that are not under that agreement. Some code is better than no cod…

You may be right. For what it's worth, we are continuously looking for members of the community who have the skills and desire to contribute positively, and empower them to do so as much as we can. There is certainly no lacking in things to improve even outside of the game itself, such as infrastructure, network services, and third-party software such as tools or game extensions. The situation about cheats is not tha…

This might sound a bit harsh and overly dramatic, but frankly you're better off not worrying about it and going the route that Super Mario speed running has taken.

They require, in the harshest of cases, (1) a full-length video of you actually playing the session, with input methods visible in frame, hosted on a publicly accessible site such as YT or Twitch, (2) game audio must be audible and undistorted, and (3) hardware input tracking software logs - I'm not sure what the application they use is called but you can easily find out. There might be other requirements I forget, you can probably google it easily.

With these things required, the community polices itself. Staying ahead of these things in code is completely wasted effort that could be spent on positive coding, which grows the community and therefore reinforces the self-policing.

These requirements might seem harsh and alienating, but I'd just say "get over it, if you want to compete, these are the rules."

Re: Worms Armageddon 3.8

#139

Post by folknor »

CyberShadow wrote: post #24
sillysaurusx wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s wonderful! Is the code open source{,able}? I used to play an old game called Underlight. When they shut it down, the owner sent me a CD with the codebase. To my eternal shame, I lost the code. It was so neat seeing the old hacks; it even overwrote the ebp register in an inner graphics loop, because apparently in the early 90’s that sort of thing made a big difference. Would love to get a glimpse at how worms’…

> That’s wonderful! Is the code open source{,able}? Unfortunately no. And, saying this as a big open source enthusiast (see profile), it would not do the game's community much good to be open-sourced right now (as the game relies almost entirely on security by obscurity to deal with multiplayer cheating). Open sourcing also would be unlikely to solve any big problems - e.g. native Linux / macOS support is not due to…

While I agree that opensourcing would be unlikely to solve any big problems, you frankly can't know. Someone might come along, especially when we're talking in timespans of decades. Probably not. But maybe.

The argument you're using here about the game depending on MS APIs and such is simply not an argument against releasing, and you know that perfectly. It is in fact an argument for releasing it open source. There's no point at which it's ideal to release the code - it can always be cleaner, more optimized, saner, and so forth.

Here[1] is an example of someone using that argument and delaying the release by first a decade, and then saying it probably won't happen at all. It's just complete nonsense - if they were afraid to release their code because it was "ugly" or "not modern", again, that's not an argument.

But obviously I have little to say about your last paragraph, except to reiterate what someone else said and asking if the code could be released without those parts :-)

1: https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Lightwor...

Re: Worms Armageddon 3.8

#140

Post by Deadcode0 »

jhasse wrote: post #126
Deadcode0 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll take this one :) Not even a hello world supports Windows 95 when compiled by MSVC 2005, and it's just because of a call to IsDebuggerPresent() in the standard library's startup code. To work around this, I overrode the definition of that function in one of WA's .cpp modules, to delay-load the real function, and return FALSE if it doesn't exist: extern "C" __declspec(noinline) BOOL WINAPI _imp__IsDebuggerPresent(…

Do you still test on Windows 95?

Yes, occasionally, under a VM (and at least one of our alpha testers has tested it on a period-correct machine). Windows 95 support isn't perfect; Hardware Cursors don't work properly (an option that didn't exist in WA v3.0) although that has a simple workaround – disabling them. And the game's taskbar button sticks on the taskbar after the game has been closed, disappearing only after being clicked. Other than that it works fine as far as we're aware.
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