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Debt Collectors Are Transforming the Business of State Courts

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Re: Debt Collectors Are Transforming the Business of State Courts

#131

Post by imtringued »

cwhiz wrote: post #93
Aloha wrote: post #20

The single largest thing we can do is undo the changes to bankruptcy law signed in 2005, it removed bankruptcy as a tool of the poor to discharge excess debt. It's caused there to be very little downside to lending, and lead to an explosion of debt.

The outcome of that will be that lending standards go up substantially. Significantly higher interest rates and required collateral. The eventual end result is fewer people able to qualify to buy a car, buy a house, get a credit card, or go to college. These are significant drivers of economic activity. It's hard to put the genie back in the bottle.

Those artificially low lending standards merely enabled loans that shouldn't exist.

Re: Debt Collectors Are Transforming the Business of State Courts

#132

Post by bluGill »

cwhiz wrote: post #93
Aloha wrote: post #20

The single largest thing we can do is undo the changes to bankruptcy law signed in 2005, it removed bankruptcy as a tool of the poor to discharge excess debt. It's caused there to be very little downside to lending, and lead to an explosion of debt.

The outcome of that will be that lending standards go up substantially. Significantly higher interest rates and required collateral. The eventual end result is fewer people able to qualify to buy a car, buy a house, get a credit card, or go to college. These are significant drivers of economic activity. It's hard to put the genie back in the bottle.

It would be good thing in the long run. Yes there would be short trem pain, but we still should make they standards higher.

Re: Debt Collectors Are Transforming the Business of State Courts

#133

Post by Thorentis »

ilamont wrote: post #47

I took a company to small claims court about 10 years ago. In my state at that time, the max you could sue for was a few thousand dollars (now it's $7k, https://www.mass.gov/service-details/small-claims-court ). It was run by a magistrate, not a judge, and AFAIK no ordinary citizens who had brought cases (including myself) had a lawyer to represent us. No surprise there ... the small claims courts are designed to wor…

Wow, it's the Court of Chancery all over again.

Re: Debt Collectors Are Transforming the Business of State Courts

#134

Post by 6510 »

What a depressing topic. Since one is responsible for his own debt and just forgiving it is unfair to those pulling their own weight perhaps the small amounts the article talks about should play part in setting the height of an initial basic income. If the income is guaranteed it can at least pay the interest over debt. It could become more interesting to get payments rather than sell peoples property and ruin their lives (and potentially their income) with all the burdens on society it brings.

Re: Debt Collectors Are Transforming the Business of State Courts

#135

Post by pests »

6510 wrote: post #134

What a depressing topic. Since one is responsible for his own debt and just forgiving it is unfair to those pulling their own weight perhaps the small amounts the article talks about should play part in setting the height of an initial basic income. If the income is guaranteed it can at least pay the interest over debt. It could become more interesting to get payments rather than sell peoples property and ruin their…

How is it unfair to forgive debt? What? Other people don't affect you.

Re: Debt Collectors Are Transforming the Business of State Courts

#136

Post by [deleted] »

sokoloff wrote: post #110
intopieces wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I contend that the debt, after being sold, is not “real” any longer, and therefore the debtor has no moral obligation to repay it. Legal? Definitely. The original lender has written the debt off, probably gotten a tax break from the government, and moved on. People and companies break contracts all the time. Moralizing over it is just a distraction from the economic and juridical forces at play.

Why would selling debt make you morally not responsible for it? My mortgage has been sold multiple times. IMO, I still 100% have a moral (and obviously legal) obligation to pay it.

[deleted]

Re: Debt Collectors Are Transforming the Business of State Courts

#137

Post by refurb »

pmiller2 wrote: post #60
jkaptur wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Programs that benefit richer people aren't framed as "social programs" and generally aren't saddled by Kafkaesque bureaucracy and scrutiny. Compare the sheer toil of using food stamps vs using the mortgage tax deduction.

Forget mortgage interest deductions. Take a look at cash back rewards cards. Cash-using households ultimately end up transferring money to card-using households this way, because merchants don't usually set higher prices for card users to compensate for fees. See https://www.bostonfed.org/publications/public-policy-discuss... I get an average of 1-2% off of almost everything I buy simply because I can use a cash back…

Is there something stopping poor people from getting these cards? I mean sure, if they have bad credit they can't, but I know plenty of poor people with good credit.

Re: Debt Collectors Are Transforming the Business of State Courts

#138

Post by refurb »

wmil wrote: post #56
refurb wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rich individuals are setup to benefit from the programs for the poor. Can you give an example how the rich benefit from programs like social security, Medicaid, food stamps?

Food stamps allow wealthy people to hire help for less than it costs to feed their children. Before anyone jumps on me, I'm not saying letting their children starve is a valid solution. But anti-poverty programs unquestionably allow illegal immigrants to work for wages less than it would take to support their families lifestyle, which encourages them to come to the US. Upper middle class and wealthy people benefit fr…

By that logic, everything that helps the poor helps the rich. Not that helpful when it comes to policy decisions.

Re: Debt Collectors Are Transforming the Business of State Courts

#139

Post by refurb »

bergstromm466 wrote: post #89
refurb wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tax rates are far lower for the poor than the rich. In fact, the wealthiest pay a majority of income taxes.

Dream on. "This is the age of rentier capitalism; rich countries are becoming rentier economies. A rising share of global income is going to rent, rather than to wages or profits from productive activities. This perpetuates inequalities: It disproportionately favors the wealthy, and accentuates inequality over generations. Through the spread of trademarks, trade secrets, copyright and, above all, patents, intellectua…

Your source says nothing about who pays the most taxes.

So let me google that for you: "the top 10% of income earners pay 70% of all income taxes".

https://www.kiplinger.com/article/taxes/T054-C000-S001-how-y...

Re: Debt Collectors Are Transforming the Business of State Courts

#140

Post by anitil »

1-more wrote: post #62
Aloha wrote: post #20

The single largest thing we can do is undo the changes to bankruptcy law signed in 2005, it removed bankruptcy as a tool of the poor to discharge excess debt. It's caused there to be very little downside to lending, and lead to an explosion of debt.

I'm begging on hands and knees for everyone in this thread to read Graeber's "Debt: the first 5,000 years." The notion that debts have to be paid is very odd. If I went to a bank and asked for a loan to bet on a horse, they'd laugh me out of the building. But if they knew that no matter what they could get the money back from me, they'd cut the check. That's where we are right now with non-dischargeable debts. Who ho…

I tried hard to read that book, but really struggled to get through it unfortunately. It seemed right down my alley but I couldn't get in to it. Might be time to dig it out and try again
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