Earlier quoted context omitted.
That is a consequence of procrastination, which is the consequence of anxiety, which is the consequence of barely meeting ends. Basically in order to be productive under those circumstances you have to ignore reality, which can be problematic for the people around you. But at the same time everything is relative on your perception of reality. We spend today 50-100 times more energy per person that people 100 years ag…
> people 100 years ago, and most of those people were happy. I’m asking out of general curiosity and not snark, but is there a reliable source to this? A cursory search on my end didn’t return anything. I often wonder if the obsession with “happiness” is a relatively recent phenomenon borne of our own privilege.
The boss who put everyone on 70K
131–140 of 381 posts
Re: The boss who put everyone on 70K
#132Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well, they could also build more homes. But Seattle has somehow decided they don't want that.
when building homes, you also need to build roads, sewers, power plants, hospitals, schools... it's not just about a few houses.
Re: The boss who put everyone on 70K
#133This is very nice of the owner, but extremely inefficient economically. Which means most companies can't afford to do something like that. Only if your profit margins are huge.
Ineffficient? It would depend on the total value add of each employee. As stated, the performance of the company increased. The capability of individual employees increased. Now, without exact numbers, I can't say economically this or that. But effectively this was not a zero sum game. The company was not paying more for the same outcome, they were paying more for more output. The output of the company increased. Thi…
Re: The boss who put everyone on 70K
#134Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Are you just asking what a 'professional' is? As in you're not a native speaker? Indeed. > Are you confusing the term with just 'anyone who works for a living'? That's not what 'professional' means. That's how it's commonly used in sports, perhaps that's where I got it from. I'd call any athlete who performs their sport for a living "professional", not because they are e.g. part of a specific league, but exactly be…
I think the amateur/professional use is a bit different, because nobody is an amateur call centre worker. > But regardless: which people in a typical company would be the professionals? People with protected titles (Lawyers, etc)? How do e.g. Engineers fit in? People who's careers would traditionally have been part of learned societies that you had to profess vows to get into, and then careers that have grown up arou…
There are political volunteer call center workers aiding the campaign of their favored candidate.
Re: The boss who put everyone on 70K
#135Oh, that story. I remember it. A lot of the high-performers left shortly after that. It was all triggered by some lawsuit in the first place anyway. The "give everyone the same salary" was like a compromise to weaken the lawsuit while at the same time to make a positive impact on media.
Alfred Nobel started the prize because his obituary was accidentally published, putting him in a bad light and he wanted to be remembered differently - we benefit from this prize today, in spite of his destructive business activities. I think it's fair to mention the fact that it was due to Price being accused of overpaying himself that the situation got turned around to be something valuable for his company and staf…
Re: The boss who put everyone on 70K
#136Re: The boss who put everyone on 70K
#137Earlier quoted context omitted.
Another thing that often gets forgotten is the cost of (long term) employees leaving. They take so much institutional knowledge with them. I'm currently watching a case unfold at a client where all people with intimate knowledge of a crucial component left - the cost of training up new people on that component will eclipse any reasonable increase in wage that they could have given to the team, not even accounting for…
I think us developer overstate how important we think this is. Unless time to market is a consideration then they will probably just accept throwing people at it and then get some poor souls to clean up afterwards.
Software engineering is mainly knowledge work. This means the majority of work consists not of building stuff, but acquiring and organising knowledge. I've read somewhere that about 50% of the job is gathering information.
When a person leaves after having spent two years at a company, it might look like you get to keep everything they've been working on, but this is far from true. If the 50% assumption is correct, a person leaving after two years means you throw a full year of work into the dump. This is a huge cost, but it's hidden.
Re: The boss who put everyone on 70K
#138Workers who feel they aren't being fairly compensated for their labor don't work as hard. They don't show as much attention to detail. They don't have any loyalty to their employers, who they perceive as exploiting them. They are much more likely to quit or leave at the first opportunity for any job that seems better. They aren't invested in good customer service. They grow to resent their employers when they work full time and still don't make enough to afford basic necessities.
Its no surprise to me that paying workers a living wage (or even something close) results in measurable benefits for a business, in a variety of ways (not to mention immeasurably improving the lives of employees).
Further (since this seems like such an alien concept to most high-wage, HN members) getting paid a decent wage also allows massive benefits to the economy and society at large. We're currently looking at a global pandemic with the coronavirus. Given the apparent virility, it seems inevitable that this virus will spread to every country in short order. Most low wage workers don't get sick leave. Many get fired even for taking unpaid sick days. These are your cashiers, your grocery store workers, the people who make your coffee - the service industry workers who make up the bulk of American labor. Even those workers who won't get fired for taking sick days, often can't afford it. We've all seen the stats about the huge number of Americans who cannot afford an emergency expense of a few hundred dollars. Staying home sick qualifies. The containment efforts we've seen in South Korea and Italy have (so far) largely failed - and these are countries with universal healthcare and worker protections that we don't have. Right now it costs $3,200 to get tested for the coronavirus in the United States. Not treated - just tested! Working people cannot afford this and will not get tested, or treated - which will make the crisis worse. How much will this crisis end up "costing" us in the long run? If not this one, how much will the next, inevitable one cost us, because working people don't have the income or benefits to take care of themselves?
Massive kudos to this guy for paying his workers a fair wage. Hopefully other employers are enlightened enough to follow his lead and do the same, with the understanding that paying adequate wages benefits not only their business, but society and the economy at large.
Re: The boss who put everyone on 70K
#139Earlier quoted context omitted.
> as any professional would be Would call center staff, receptionists etc not be professionals (I.e. is there a use of the term I'm not aware of?). Is it people doing work requiring degrees?
> Would call center staff, receptionists etc not be professionals Are you just asking what a 'professional' is? As in you're not a native speaker? The etymology is from 'someone who has professed vows' and traditionally means someone who's part of some kind of learned society. In the past it was classes like doctors, lawyers, religious ministers. Over the industrial revolution it began to include engineers. Engineers…
To a certain extent, I think you are guilty of relaxing the definition just as you accuse the OP of doing.
Strictly defined “professional engineers” are licensed and do take those vows of ethical behavior. However, the vast majority of people claiming an engineer title do not meet this criteria. While somewhat pedantic, it does carry legal meaning. Some states have even brought lawsuits in this regard, although I think they were ruled against.
Re: The boss who put everyone on 70K
#140Earlier quoted context omitted.
> people 100 years ago, and most of those people were happy. I’m asking out of general curiosity and not snark, but is there a reliable source to this? A cursory search on my end didn’t return anything. I often wonder if the obsession with “happiness” is a relatively recent phenomenon borne of our own privilege.
Considering it being prominently featured in the US Declaration of Independence, it seems not to be too new.