Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

bloomberg.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

131–140 of 718 posts

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#131

Post by ardit33 »

sudosteph wrote: post #56

Native North Carolinian checking in. I'm from Charlotte and I can honestly say that I grew up with more friends who had parents from New York than from NC. A lot of middle class people from upstate NY settled in Charlotte due to the economic opportunities and weather. I'd wager that this migration really started about 30 years ago, and we're seeing the numbers increase even further due to network effects. For example…

Upstate NY and NYC proper are very different areas (might as well be different states). Upstate NY have more in common with west MA, Vermont, NH, than with folks in the NYC area (where most of NY residents live).

The difference even more than someone from Alexandria/D.C with south VA, (e.g Danville, Roanoke, Halifax County etc...).

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#132

Post by throw51319 »

mbesto wrote: post #96
siculars wrote: post #9

Having left NYC for Texas 5 years ago, I can confirm the grass is greener on the other side.

Having lived in NYC, SV, London and Chicago, living in Austin has been dream. That being said, it's pretty clear it's heading towards Seattle levels, which is quickly headed towards SF levels of societal issues.

What about it has been a dream? Very curious as I live in nyc right now and want to make a change. How has NYC stacked against these other places?

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#133

Post by sudosteph »

magduf wrote: post #60
OrangeMango wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Illinois has high taxes and terrible weather Illinois has a flat income tax; at $135k income you would only be beat by the states that have no income tax (like Florida). Most of the states on that list also have weather that is either terrible in the summer or terrible in the winter, so I doubt that weather is really a factor in people moving.

You'd be surprised; I've met plenty of people that talk about how much they like warm weather and want to move south for that reason. Personally, I lived in Arizona for a while and have no desire to live in a hot climate again.

I think it's the snow that really gets people. It just interferes with everyday life in a way heat doesn't (ie, limiting car usage and driving safety until it's cleared). This mostly applies to car-oriented lifestyles though - since walking in high heat vs snowy or icy conditions are both quite risky.

Also, there is actually a pretty strong correlation between shoveling snow and heart attacks in older folks: https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/can-shoveling-snow-put-y... . So it definitely makes sense to relocate if that is a factor.

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#134

Post by altoidaltoid »

harimau777 wrote: post #116
snickerbockers wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it's reasonable to criticize them no matter what because they're preventing other people from having the same opportunities that they were afforded.

I'm not advocating that more housing shouldn't be built. What I am saying is that there is a middle ground between allowing existing homeowners to veto any proposals and not giving them any say or protection.

https://www.amazon.com/Neighborhood-Defenders-Participatory-...

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#135

Post by triceratops »

option wrote: post #25
triceratops wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> $600k avg home price. > homeless encampments on our bike trails These seem linked somehow...

Are they really? An honest question - suppose the housing does a nosedive to 100K. I still find it hard to believe that those living on the streets in tents with no jobs will rush to buy houses. The other category of “invisible” homeless - those living in cars and at friends places/garages will of course benefit if the average price of the housing drops

If housing prices nosedive, so does rent. Not everyone in a tent encampment needs to be a buyer.

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#137

Post by jedberg »

hangonhn wrote: post #98
jedberg wrote: post #83

[flagged]

The heat and humidity are there but Houston and Dallas aren't as conservative as you might imagine. I used to live in Dallas and have a ton of friends in Houston who are liberals or at least centrists. I would say give people a chance to show you their best side. I was in Texas only a couple of years but people there aren't any less kind than people in California. I'm not advocating leaving California but rather if H…

No but that State house is, and they are the ones that make the education standards and choose the textbooks that erase any mention of Americans being the bad actors.

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#139

Post by davidw »

harimau777 wrote: post #125
grandmczeb wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The aesthetic preferences of crotchety neighbors should be close to the bottom of our housing priorities.

I don't think it's fair to assume without evidence that existing homeowner are "crotchety neighbors". It's quite possible that they have legitimate concerns that, and would support new construction if their concerns were addressed.

Go to public hearings. Their demands are almost never reasonable. New housing should never add any traffic ever, and it should look fantastic (with different people differing on what this means) and it shouldn't have children because there's no way the schools could cope with the "massive increase", and it should have enough parking to handle the entire extended family at Thanksgiving (in a severely land-constrained area) and by the way it should also be actually "affordable" (far below market rates).

They really don't generally argue in good faith.

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#140

Post by wwweston »

jedberg wrote: post #55

Every person I know who's left California did it because of housing costs (except for one, who did it to get away from "the damn liberal government that wants to take my guns"). We have a major housing cost crisis in this state, as well as a big NIMBY problem. There have been good solutions run up through the state house, that either fail to pass or get so watered down they are no longer effective, in large part beca…

> There have been good solutions run up through the state house

What are the best solutions you've seen?

> They only want to help poor people if it doesn't affect their property value.

I'm sure there are some unsavory high net worth individuals who are happy to support policies keeping housing expensive just to keep assets inflated even if it means access to housing is harder for everyone.

But I'd guess for a lot of people it's more practical: when most of your net worth has become accidentally tied up in your home, some changes may mean you risk becoming one of the poor or homeless. Or visceral: you perceive risk, even though it isn't there (some folks fear a neighborhood light rail stop only to find their property values jump). Or just seeing your community change can be uncomfortable

And while I don't know if the solutions you're thinking of are of the "bring more supply online" kind... there's something weird with the issues in California if the story of net outflow is true. The fact that rents can jump over 60% in a decade while the demand pool is stable or shrinking means that this isn't an ordinary supply problem. Either the existing supply is being manipulated in some way, or some portions of the demand pool can offer a lot more than others pricing the rest out of the market. Solutions that are entirely focused on MOAR SUPPLY may be just as likely allow present dynamics to happen at a somewhat larger scale as they are to fix a macro problem.

Post reply on HN