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Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

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Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#131

Post by FabHK »

cowpig wrote: post #129

I had never seen the word "shibboleth" before reading the article about "The Real Class War" this week, and now I'm seeing it in the title of a submission days later. It's not spiking in google trends[1], but I wonder if the usage of this word spiking in this community? Or did this twitter user read that article? Or is it just coincidence? [1] https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%201-m&q=...

Might be the Baader-Meinhof effect.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cognitive_biases#Frequ...

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#132

Post by btrettel »

fortran77 wrote: post #103
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #81

Many of these are equivalent to demanding to speak to the manager in order to get what you want. That can backfire quickly if you’re not careful. > Present as if you are collecting a paper trail. Prominent indicia of this include notebooks, organized files, and repeatedly asking for specific names, dates, and citations for authority “for my notes.” I worked at a smaller company where any semi-threatening support requ…

Right. And what really backfires is threatening to sue. In a company large enough to have a legal department, they'll hand you over to it, and basically nothing will get fixed. They'll record your complaints, dates, and times, and stop interacting with you.

This hasn't been my experience. I can recall one time where, after spending hours on the phone getting nowhere, I mentioned getting a lawyer involved. The company forwarded me to someone with a title like "solutions architect" who quickly solved the problem I was having. The other people I spoke with wouldn't even answer basic questions.

It probably helped that the company is in a highly regulated industry.

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#133

Post by [deleted] »

cowpig wrote: post #129

I had never seen the word "shibboleth" before reading the article about "The Real Class War" this week, and now I'm seeing it in the title of a submission days later. It's not spiking in google trends[1], but I wonder if the usage of this word spiking in this community? Or did this twitter user read that article? Or is it just coincidence? [1] https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%201-m&q=...

[deleted]

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#134

Post by runjake »

1024core wrote: post #114
nkrisc wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This method works wonders for corporate tech support. They're pretty used to the "my monitor won't turn on (it's not plugged in)" type users so when you try to tell them you know what's wrong, they assume you're there former type and you have no idea what you're talking about. Instead I very clearly tell them the specific symptoms and relevant information that they would look up anyway. Recently I had a corporate ins…

As always, there's an XKCD for this: https://xkcd.com/806/

We know. This XKCD is why this Twitter thread exists in the first place.

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#135

Post by FabHK »

freehunter wrote: post #100
coldtea wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As a Hebrew speaker, I wish the "shibboleth" idiom (which is a good one) was translated, rather than transliterated. laoned idioms are inherently exotic, and this one is worth demystifying Well, it was neither translated, nor transliterated. It was adopted as an english word, with its own dictionary definition and everything. The definition happens to coincide with the Hebrew, but it could just as well not (there a…

That's (for better or worse) an almost defining characteristic of the English language. We take words from other languages and adopt them as English words. It doesn't matter if the word in English means the same thing as the original word, it doesn't matter what language it came from, it doesn't matter if we're combining two words from different languages to make a new word (television is the Greek word 'tele' combin…

Many languages adopt words, but English does so to an unusual degree. As a consequence, it is the language that has most words today, by far.

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#136

Post by fortran77 »

crazygringo wrote: post #117
fortran77 wrote: post #111

Today, Jews who attend synagogue know the bible, because it's read, chapter by chapter, out loud, every Shabbat, Monday, and Thursday, and continuously studied in yearly and multi-year cycles. Yesterday, Jews everywhere heard the story of Esau and Jacob, read in Hebrew. I don't think any Christian denomination does this, so unless you attend a specfic religious school you'll never learn the Christian bible (which inc…

Sorry, but this is a completely inaccurate generalization of both Jews and Christians, both of which are incredibly diverse populations with practices that vary incredibly widely by denomination, country/region and social group. Bible study groups are a common Christian thing in many, many churches, for one. Also, it's fairly loaded to suggest that Christians "appropriated" the Old Testament. Perhaps you could choose…

It is in poor taste to refer to the Hebrew Bible as the "old Testament."

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#137

Post by sudosteph »

netcan wrote: post #10

This is (hopefully not) obnoxiously off-topic... As a Hebrew speaker, I wish the "shibboleth" idiom (which is a good one) was translated, rather than transliterated. laoned idioms are inherently exotic, and this one is worth demystifying It means any choice of word (or pronunciation, in the literal example) that clearly identifies the speaker's group affiliations. A good modern example is "LondonDerry/Derry. This'd b…

A good one in the Southern U.S. is the pronunciation of the word "Appalachian". I'm from NC and whenever I hear someone say "Appa-lay-shin" I immediately know they aren't local and I start acting a little different accordingly. Not in a mean way, but I know I can't open up completely to those people because from experience I know they might judge me according to stereotypes about that region.

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#138

Post by hawaiian »

aazaa wrote: post #127

> (This is partly about demeanor, above all not looking confused about the process, and partly judicious use of shibboleths. I’m occasionally surprised how few are required; it isn’t a state secret that “500mg of acetaminophen” and “a Tylenol” are the same thing.) I can't think of a single situation in which it's a good idea to make it appear as if your medical knowledge is greater than it is. When the conversation s…

It would be remarkable if one could be allergic to a general antihistamine such as diphenhydramine. If anything I would suspect an allergy to an adjunct or inactive component.

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#139

Post by saagarjha »

sudosteph wrote: post #137
netcan wrote: post #10

This is (hopefully not) obnoxiously off-topic... As a Hebrew speaker, I wish the "shibboleth" idiom (which is a good one) was translated, rather than transliterated. laoned idioms are inherently exotic, and this one is worth demystifying It means any choice of word (or pronunciation, in the literal example) that clearly identifies the speaker's group affiliations. A good modern example is "LondonDerry/Derry. This'd b…

A good one in the Southern U.S. is the pronunciation of the word "Appalachian". I'm from NC and whenever I hear someone say "Appa-lay-shin" I immediately know they aren't local and I start acting a little different accordingly. Not in a mean way, but I know I can't open up completely to those people because from experience I know they might judge me according to stereotypes about that region.

How would you pronounce it? Appa-lah-chi-an?

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#140

Post by Nextgrid »

notacoward wrote: post #67

I've found that pretending to know someone's profession, or one related to it, is generally a very bad approach. It's easily seen through, at which point you're worse off than before. Instead, what I do with members of other professions is try to impress on them that I do not know their business but respect its complexity and our roles within the scenario. Whether it's a doctor or a plumber or even a computer technic…

I agree with this in cases of legitimate, friendly companies that are proud of what they do and want to provide a good service.

This breaks down when dealing with monopolies and companies that are too big to fail. Customer service in their case is always monkeys (from my experience) - they aren’t paid enough to care, they don’t know anything about their company’s product/service (because a skilled person wouldn’t put up with the low pay and working conditions) and have very limited power in actually fixing your problem even when they understand it.

In that case scaring them into escalating the call might be a better strategy than just running around in circles trying to make a monkey understand what you’re after.

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