Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Candidates for Mozilla's IRC Successor

exple.tive.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

131–140 of 219 posts

Re: Candidates for Mozilla's IRC Successor

#131

Post by thedanbob »

derin wrote: post #76
22c wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they really have a highly usable product Setting up a Matrix server is a lot harder than you might think, especially when you start talking about federation and identity management. The mxisd[1] project has recently disbanded due to what I believe to be philosophical differences with the Matrix maintainers vision of identity management. I like a lot of things about Riot/Synapse, but I would suggest you try setting…

It was pretty straight forward to install/set up? There are some requirements to be able to federate, namely having a domain and associated certs for encryption, but otherwise nothing stood out as overtly obtuse/difficult. You have to either make a venv for a binary or just install a package, then reverse proxy 2 ports from your http daemon, and finally also hook things up to your Postgres database. After all that it…

If you don't mind Docker, I success this ansible playbook: https://github.com/spantaleev/matrix-docker-ansible-deploy

Great documentation and sane defaults. I have only 6 lines of custom config.

Re: Candidates for Mozilla's IRC Successor

#132

Post by ptman »

dijit wrote: post #93
Nasreddin_Hodja wrote: post #91

I've read somewhere that matrix server uses too much RAM due to bad design. Personally I'd prefer XMPP.

It's not a bad design, it's just the reference implementation is python based, and, well, a reference implementation; so they don't do too much for optimisations and focus instead on readability. When Matrix as a protocol settles more, we'll start seeing optimised versions of the server, I'm certain of it.

dendrite, the next-gen server written in go, made good progress this summer thanks to GSoC, but contributions are always welcome

Re: Candidates for Mozilla's IRC Successor

#133

Post by Arathorn »

Arathorn wrote: post #96
rtpg wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like Matrix is basically the "real standard" here that supports a lot more than IRC. The question for me is about how easy it is to build a client for that (IRC is stupid easy, of course). Ideally you should be able to build a Matrix client in something like a Python REPL and like 20 lines of code with an `input` loop at the end. I don't know if that's the case at the moment.

Ooooh... sounds like a fun challenge :D I've typed this out straight into the HN input box so it almost certainly doesn't work and will be full of typos and escaping bugs, but for illustrative purposes: here's what a ~8 line Matrix client for basic bi-directional chat in a given room could look like (complete with login) in almost-bash, with deps only on curl and jq: USERNAME='@whoever:matrix.org'; SERVER='https://ma…

Too late to edit the original post, but thanks to anoa for fixing up my crappy bash there's a version that actually works now at https://github.com/ara4n/random/blob/master/bashtrix.sh. The uglinesses are mainly bash's fault rather than matrix's ;P

Re: Candidates for Mozilla's IRC Successor

#134

Post by anoa_ »

Arathorn wrote: post #133
Arathorn wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ooooh... sounds like a fun challenge :D I've typed this out straight into the HN input box so it almost certainly doesn't work and will be full of typos and escaping bugs, but for illustrative purposes: here's what a ~8 line Matrix client for basic bi-directional chat in a given room could look like (complete with login) in almost-bash, with deps only on curl and jq: USERNAME='@whoever:matrix.org'; SERVER='https://ma…

Too late to edit the original post, but thanks to anoa for fixing up my crappy bash there's a version that actually works now at https://github.com/ara4n/random/blob/master/bashtrix.sh . The uglinesses are mainly bash's fault rather than matrix's ;P

welcome :)

Re: Candidates for Mozilla's IRC Successor

#135

Post by iamnotacrook »

radus wrote: post #14
bhhaskin wrote: post #3

Why move away from IRC at all? If it ain't broken why "fix" it.

My experiences as an infrequent IRC user over many years: - hmm, I have to download a client? maybe I can access a web interface? - okay, I have this connection string/url - how do I join a channel? - how do I set my nickname? is this persistent? - oh someone else is using my name? is this for the channel or the server?? - what's the etiquette of this particular channel? (I realize this is probably the case for any c…

"I have a question and there are a few people about so I'll ask it....(10 mins later)... ok no-one's answered... no-one's said anything, in fact. I hope they can see me. Oh well, I'll just browse away from this tab/close the IRC client and just reconnect later on or tomorrow and see if there's an answer. I'll just reconnect and scroll back up and see all the history I missed. It'll be fine... (next day)...Uh...where's my history?"

Re: Candidates for Mozilla's IRC Successor

#136

Post by microcolonel »

esotericn wrote: post #26

I have full faith that, if I had left a computer running, in the corner of my home, with an IRC client open, it would have been able to maintain a connection to Freenode (not continuously, but just work) for fifteen or more years. Personally I don't think IRC will ever be replaced. Well, it will, but it'll happen when my generation dies and gets fully replaced with the New Shiny. I _hope_ that some sort of real, prop…

I've been on Freenode since my tweens. Maybe the long term thing is overlay protocols, to solve the issues with directly connecting to IRC on mobile, and with shelling into a client on the same.

Re: Candidates for Mozilla's IRC Successor

#137

Post by Arathorn »

dngray wrote: post #89
esotericn wrote: post #26

I have full faith that, if I had left a computer running, in the corner of my home, with an IRC client open, it would have been able to maintain a connection to Freenode (not continuously, but just work) for fifteen or more years. Personally I don't think IRC will ever be replaced. Well, it will, but it'll happen when my generation dies and gets fully replaced with the New Shiny. I _hope_ that some sort of real, prop…

I am hoping they go with Matrix, least then I will be able to have the choice of having a client appropriate to my needs. I do prefer my chat client to not be a part of my browser. That way I can close my browser, start my browser and chat client on login ie from i3/sway etc. A tab in a browser runs the risk of getting closed. I love using weechat (weechat.org) and have used it for decades. The Matrix plugin for Weec…

weechat-matrix even supports single sign on login (as of yesterday: https://github.com/poljar/weechat-matrix/commit/1a846d61ae07...) so it should work nicely with Mozilla's IAM SSO: https://wiki.mozilla.org/IAM/Frequently_asked_questions

Re: Candidates for Mozilla's IRC Successor

#138

Post by ori_b »

dsr_ wrote: post #126
ori_b wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I admit, I never used zulip -- I don't like using chat from the browser, so I generally stick to things that I can connect to from chat clients. - What does it replace channels with? - How does it keep my github account separate from the identity I'm using in chat? - How does it avoid etiquette in channels? - Does it let me ignore or mute annoying people? - Is it possible to easily archive communication for posterity…

Zulip uses three classes of communication: Streams which are like IRC channels; each stream has named threads (users are encouraged to reuse or start new ones as appropriate); and private messages can be 1:1 or multiparty. Zulip doesn't do anything with github other than the regex-based integration -- you can create links more easily, that's it. Nothing avoids etiquette or enforces etiquette except people. Muting can…

> Nothing avoids etiquette or enforces etiquette except people.

So why is it listed as an IRC specific problem?

> Zulip defaults to full archiving of everything, and making it searchable as well.

I have IRC logs from dead networks dating from over 15 years ago, and I still sometimes look things up in them. I don't want to trust Zulip to survive 15 years.

Re: Candidates for Mozilla's IRC Successor

#139

Post by ori_b »

dsr_ wrote: post #126
ori_b wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I admit, I never used zulip -- I don't like using chat from the browser, so I generally stick to things that I can connect to from chat clients. - What does it replace channels with? - How does it keep my github account separate from the identity I'm using in chat? - How does it avoid etiquette in channels? - Does it let me ignore or mute annoying people? - Is it possible to easily archive communication for posterity…

Zulip uses three classes of communication: Streams which are like IRC channels; each stream has named threads (users are encouraged to reuse or start new ones as appropriate); and private messages can be 1:1 or multiparty. Zulip doesn't do anything with github other than the regex-based integration -- you can create links more easily, that's it. Nothing avoids etiquette or enforces etiquette except people. Muting can…

> Nothing avoids etiquette or enforces etiquette except people.

So why is it listed as an IRC specific problem?

> Zulip defaults to full archiving of everything, and making it searchable as well.

I have IRC logs from dead networks dating from over 15 years ago, and I still sometimes look things up in them. I don't want to trust Zulip to survive 15 years.

> Zulip doesn't do anything with github other than the regex-based integration

I see. The parent poster implied that there's no need to pick a username, and that he logs in with GitHub. That implied that it used your GitHub account name, since I don't see another way to enforce unique names.

Re: Candidates for Mozilla's IRC Successor

#140

Post by coldpie »

techntoke wrote: post #68
EamonnMR wrote: post #34

Really excited to see Discord rejected. Watching Discord take over open source and free culture communities has been disheartening to say the least.

You must really dislike GitHub then.

I can't speak for the OP of this thread, but I agree with them and yes, I really dislike GitHub, too.
Post reply on HN