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Winnti: Hackers attacking the heart of German industry

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Re: Winnti: Hackers attacking the heart of German industry

#131

Post by ozim »

rb2k_ wrote: post #85
PinguTS wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Funfact: more than 30% value in a car is software, which is highly interconnected via various type of networks namely, LIN, CAN, MOST, FlexRay, Ethernet. Most current premium cars have more than 10 of those networks and around 100 to 130 ECUs that talk to each other. So much about: they don't know about software. BTW: The difference between IT and automotive aka embedded is that embedded should work even without DevO…

Having worked at a German company (in Germany) that creates tooling for that kind of software development. They had a huge smalltalk program that created embedded C code (AUTOSAR/MISRA if I remember correctly). Tests only ran manually and the coverage wasn't particularly high. I don't recall any automations that would have stopped you from saving new code that breaks tests to the smalltalk image. Even though it 'work…

It is not 10 years ago but something around that time I was working on automated tests for car equipment. Quite a lot of it was still semi-manual because you had to change some things with physical buttons that you would have in car, but voltage changes, and quite a lot of sensor inputs we had automated. Was quite easy because you could fake CAN connected devices.

Re: Winnti: Hackers attacking the heart of German industry

#132

Post by mschuster91 »

HeWhoLurksLate wrote: post #75
mbeex wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People avoid SV/USA due to the current President _some_ people do. Others allow themselves different opinions to this president and even to their prospects in SV > and London due to the Brexit uncertainity True > before Johnson drives everything into the ground ... but also here there are different opinions concerning the nature of this uncertainty

Aaaand some people care more about their life than they do their country's politics, thankfully. IMO, politics and stuff is necessary, but I really wish we could argue /debate respectfully without the damn flame wars everywhere of late. It seriously puts me off.

The point is that the current Trump administration has a massive problem with immigration - that may or may not have consequences if you want to emigrate to the US. Or Brexit - if Johnson really delivers a no deal Brexit then UK economy is getting fucked over hard plus the right of free movement for EU citizens vanishes so you can get deported overnight.

Politics at this scale are life changing matters, and unfortunately with both the US and the UK governments it is clear that they are not run by competent people with a plan but by people who literally don't have any fixed opinion except nationalism - and that means that, as an immigrant, you're rock bottom of the ladder.

Re: Winnti: Hackers attacking the heart of German industry

#133

Post by mschuster91 »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #67
mschuster91 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what? With 210€ a year it's not much more expensive than the 162€ in UK, for example. At least they're politically neutral and stick to facts and solid journalistic work, compared to private TV stations or the Axel Springer Verlag...

Except the BBC produces much more high quality content, consumed worldwide(former Top Gear) on a smaller budget than Germany which has little to show for in quality content of international or even national succes.

UK content is simply consumed worldwide because it's english. German is only spoken in three countries - Germany, Austria and Switzerland. Everything produced here must be synchronized or subbed making exports expensive, in addition to Germans not liking risky experiments very much which means there is less interest.

Re: Winnti: Hackers attacking the heart of German industry

#134

Post by kayoone »

odiroot wrote: post #72
kayoone wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. Salaries of 70-90k EUR for Senior devs in Berlin are absolutely achievable and combined with the quite low cost of living in Berlin you probably have more fun money than anywhere in Europe as a developer.

Anything above high 60's is really a pipe dream in this current market.

Its just from my personal experience, but i know a lot of people in the 70k+ range at different companies, all senior though. We also interview a lot and a considerable amount of candidates that get offered high sixties go somewhere else where they got a better offer.

Re: Winnti: Hackers attacking the heart of German industry

#135

Post by paganel »

ulfw wrote: post #120
paganel wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you wouldn't feel confident driving 400 miles in a 2019 German car because of software? Because of software and electronics combined, yes. > What do you envision going wrong? One of my closest friends purchased a VW Tiguan last year and not two weeks into his ownership the car left him stranded at the side of the read because of a coolant hose or something similar. If VW cannot make a simple hose not break after on…

"One of my closest friends purchased a Macbook last year and not two weeks into his ownership the notebook left him stranded at the side of the read because of a power cable breaking or something similar. If Apple cannot make a simple power cable not break after only two weeks in a 3,000 euros notebook I cannot trust their software verification processes and I'm not willing to spend that much money in order to find o…

You do know that there's a strong correlation between Apple's downward standards in how they physically manufacture their latest laptops and the quality (or lack of) of their latest OSes, don't you? I don't want to start an endless Apple-related flamewar but the links and discussions about this subject on this very website are countless.

Like I said, if you're not bothered anymore of doing basic quality testing for things like coolant hoses then how can I trust the same company with doing basic quality testing for their software?

> if they cannot properly verify a simple power cable I cannot trust them with properly verifying software.

Yes, one of the reasons why I told my boss that I don't want a 2,500 euros Apple laptop (I chose a Mini instead, they're more sturdy, less expensive and I gathered more difficult to fuck up) were articles like this one [1]. And yes, it does involve a cable fuck-up.

[1] https://www.theverge.com/2019/3/19/18271733/flexgate-display...

Re: Winnti: Hackers attacking the heart of German industry

#136

Post by vanilla-almond »

mschuster91 wrote: post #133
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except the BBC produces much more high quality content, consumed worldwide(former Top Gear) on a smaller budget than Germany which has little to show for in quality content of international or even national succes.

UK content is simply consumed worldwide because it's english . German is only spoken in three countries - Germany, Austria and Switzerland. Everything produced here must be synchronized or subbed making exports expensive, in addition to Germans not liking risky experiments very much which means there is less interest.

Although the BBC produces a lot of rubbish, it also produces high quality drama, comedies and documentaries. People watch these not simply because they are in English.

People will watch quality programming regardless of the language. Just witness the popularity of Scandinavian dramas that have won audiences across the world. Although Germany dubs foreign-language programmes (badly), lots of other countries are happy to watch with subtitles.

Re: Winnti: Hackers attacking the heart of German industry

#137

Post by oblio »

tomp wrote: post #104
oblio wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Getting double the vacation time (6 weeks instead of 3) when I moved from the US to Germany was very nice, but going back I'll have 5 weeks, which isn't too bad. I keep hearing this. Yes, you will get 5 weeks. But what about your wife, your uncle, your friends? In Germany they're all guaranteed to have the same number of days off, access to healthcare, etc. When you have kids you have a bunch of weeks/months off be…

But that's the point of US, no? It's the best country for the best people. So, the best people go to the US... (well, many at least... I'm still holding out... for now, I value European way of life but I envy US political & legal systems, in particular their freedom of speech).

You can can't have 300 million best people. You can't even have 100 million.

And once someone acquires citizenship, their descendants can't lose it, provided it's their only citizenship.

Re: Winnti: Hackers attacking the heart of German industry

#138

Post by tgsovlerkhgsel »

mtgx wrote: post #20
bobjordan wrote: post #16

"Modern-day espionage operations have one big advantage: Instead of painstakingly planting agents in companies, digital spies are simply sending prepared emails." We face this threat in my business - daily fishing attempts or schemes to get employees to open files. It never stops. This is a primary reason when we started designing our new web app at bomquote.com a few years ago, we first focused on communication tool…

Using U2F security keys is one way to stop phishing if the app you're supposed to log into requires it. https://krebsonsecurity.com/2018/07/google-security-keys-neu...

Unfortunately "phishing" nowadays is used to describe any kind of social engineering, including all variants of tricking the victim into executing malware on their machine.

U2F won't save you there, it will just make the attack a bit more annoying.

Re: Winnti: Hackers attacking the heart of German industry

#139

Post by southerndrift »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #11
lnsru wrote: post #10

As of today we still use shared network drives for everything in major German company. We don’t use slack/irc/Skype/zoom/whatever. Phone calls and conferences(!) from the middle of open office is normal. Asana/Trello/Jira are not known at all. GitHub is paid for, but never used. I am single weirdo in multi department project using github ticket system. The code with prefix is copied for colleagues to project’s shared…

Germany's tech illiteracy is a self-inflicted consequence of its pitiful salaries in this field, treating IT like a cost center that has to be outsourced to wherever is cheaper and companies' tradition of rewarding management incompetence over technical competence. Consequently, Germany's most brilliant tech minds leave for The Valley, Zurich or London. You reap what you sow.

To add to this: The CDU (conservative party) turned back the decision to role out a fiber network across Germany that would have been constructed from the 80ies until the millenium [1]. If you actively burn your fields, then there is nothing to reap.

[1] https://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/Missing-Link-Der-Kam...

Re: Winnti: Hackers attacking the heart of German industry

#140

Post by hiram112 »

srrr wrote: post #109
odiroot wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Salary for developers really isn't that much of an issue. Yes, it absolutely is. And Berlin is the best example; we're even underpaid by German standards.

Many (senior) developers I know in Berlin get 80000€/year gross income. That is in the top 6% of incomes in Germany. (Top 6% income bracket in the USA would be 150000$/year.) I don't even get 80k€/year and have a very luxurious and high quality life in Berlin. Resource: https://wid.world/simulator/

In Germany, with an 80000€ salary, what would be the monthly take home in your pocket? And I'm assuming they would take out taxes for health system, pension, vacation, etc.

In the US in an average taxed state, compare a $150K salary: After federal and state taxes, our old person medical and retirement (i.e. FICA), maximum retirement investment of about $19K, health insurance, disability insurance, dental, etc, one will end up with about $7200 a month or $86K / year in their pocket, which is roughly 42% taxes and retirement. This includes 3 weeks of vacation and 10 Federal holidays.

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