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SerenityOS – a graphical Unix-like OS for x86, with 90s aesthetics

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Re: SerenityOS – a graphical Unix-like OS for x86, with 90s aesthetics

#131

Post by innst »

akling wrote: post #13

Hello friends, author here! Fun to see my project on HN again. If you would like to see the system in action, I did a demo video in March[1] and one in April[2]. I’m happy to answer any questions you might have about the system. I’m not an expert on operating systems, but I can be pretty productive :) [1] https://youtu.be/hE52D-zbX3g [2] https://youtu.be/RBr5If8GrM4

This is some awesome work! From the looks of it, your window server architecture is similar to wayland's, so would it be possible to port the GUI library to Linux/Wayland? Then someone could write a wayland compositor using wlroots that mimics the W95 aesthetics and there you have it: the ultimate 90's UI on a system that's actually usable for day to day tasks.

Re: SerenityOS – a graphical Unix-like OS for x86, with 90s aesthetics

#132

Post by jxdxbx »

c256 wrote: post #97
reaperducer wrote: post #25

I think this is an impressive achievement, and certainly something I could never do. But I'm a little disappointed in the state of desktop operating systems these days. I don't see any innovation. Every OS is just splashing chrome on the same WIMP paradigm that's been available to consumers for 35 years. Maybe I'm looking for the equivalent of a flying car, but I wish someone would come up with an OS, or even just an…

Have you seen Plan 9? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plan_9_from_Bell_Labs

My favorite somewhat-rethought OS is GoboLinux, which is not as different as Plan9 since it's basically just Linux, but it totally throws out the traditional Unix folder hierarchy of /bin, /etc, /var and so on. I also like the simplicity of classic Mac OS where you install a system extension by just copying it to a special folder and you uninstall an app by just deleting it (which sort of works with current macOS but apps still strew preferences all over the place).

Re: SerenityOS – a graphical Unix-like OS for x86, with 90s aesthetics

#134

Post by repolfx »

sprash wrote: post #93
reaperducer wrote: post #25

I think this is an impressive achievement, and certainly something I could never do. But I'm a little disappointed in the state of desktop operating systems these days. I don't see any innovation. Every OS is just splashing chrome on the same WIMP paradigm that's been available to consumers for 35 years. Maybe I'm looking for the equivalent of a flying car, but I wish someone would come up with an OS, or even just an…

> I don't see any innovation. To me to Windows95 UI (not the OS) is peak productivity usability. All UI innovations that came later were just distractions except maybe tiling window managers and the "Exposé" function in Mac Os X which later was completely botched in Snow Leopard. At some point no further innovation is required. I'd rather see innovation on another level: Do away with C and introduce a new programming…

You don't need a new programming language for that - any type safe, memory safe language with capabilities can do it. Java or C# are good candidates. Especially with the work on Project Loom in the JVM, you could get cooperative multi-tasking controlled by the compiler rather than using processor interrupts (in theory). See Singularity for an example of what kind of interesting OS architectures are enabled by it.

The elephant in the room is Spectre. It's no longer clear you can actually keep any secrets inside an address space on speculating CPUs. So if all your code runs in a single address space, even if it works in theory, it may not work in practice. But this opens up the interesting research problem of Spectre mitigations :)

One idea I've wondered about is whether you can use the very new Intel features to rapidly change access permissions on page table entries, such that you could have a totally unified but segmented heap, but entering or leaving lower privileged code modules triggers a fast address space transition.

Re: SerenityOS – a graphical Unix-like OS for x86, with 90s aesthetics

#135

Post by repolfx »

akling wrote: post #124
TBF-RnD wrote: post #71

Kinda broke right now but consider his patreon the world needs more of this!!

Thank you for shouting out my Patreon![1] I'm never going to ask anyone for money, but I'm extremely grateful that some people have chosen to support this project financially. The only "goal" I have set up on Patreon is hitting 1000 supporters. If things ever get that crazy, I'll stop whatever I'm doing and focus only on Serenity. For now that's just a fun daydream though :) [1] https://www.patreon.com/serenityos

If you don't mind me asking, how do you support yourself and why did you choose to dedicate your time to this project?

Re: SerenityOS – a graphical Unix-like OS for x86, with 90s aesthetics

#136

Post by akling »

hardbop200 wrote: post #133

Awesome work! Just curious: Why did you choose to take on the entire OS instead of building on top of an existing distro as a base?

Thanks hardbop200! Partly it's because I'm the kind of person who just loves hacking on tall stacks. Before this, I was doing browsers for many years, which has many traits in common with operating systems.

Speaking more emotionally, I feel like *nix used to be a lot of fun and full of hacker's spirit, and it's just not like that anymore. Things aren't simple anymore, and they can't easily be taken apart and understood in an evening, like they used to. So I figured I can just make my own then, just the way I like it :)

Re: SerenityOS – a graphical Unix-like OS for x86, with 90s aesthetics

#137

Post by akling »

innst wrote: post #131
akling wrote: post #13

Hello friends, author here! Fun to see my project on HN again. If you would like to see the system in action, I did a demo video in March[1] and one in April[2]. I’m happy to answer any questions you might have about the system. I’m not an expert on operating systems, but I can be pretty productive :) [1] https://youtu.be/hE52D-zbX3g [2] https://youtu.be/RBr5If8GrM4

This is some awesome work! From the looks of it, your window server architecture is similar to wayland's, so would it be possible to port the GUI library to Linux/Wayland? Then someone could write a wayland compositor using wlroots that mimics the W95 aesthetics and there you have it: the ultimate 90's UI on a system that's actually usable for day to day tasks.

Sure, the GUI library could definitely be ported to anywhere POSIX-y. The IPC messaging is already based on AF_LOCAL sockets so that should "just work"

The bitmap sharing between WindowServer and clients is using a custom Serenity API ("create_shared_buffer") which is specifically tailored for this system. It can probably be replaced with some equivalent X11/Wayland mechanism in a few hours, if someone felt inclined to do that. :)

Re: SerenityOS – a graphical Unix-like OS for x86, with 90s aesthetics

#139

Post by akling »

repolfx wrote: post #135
akling wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for shouting out my Patreon![1] I'm never going to ask anyone for money, but I'm extremely grateful that some people have chosen to support this project financially. The only "goal" I have set up on Patreon is hitting 1000 supporters. If things ever get that crazy, I'll stop whatever I'm doing and focus only on Serenity. For now that's just a fun daydream though :) [1] https://www.patreon.com/serenityos

If you don't mind me asking, how do you support yourself and why did you choose to dedicate your time to this project?

Sure, I don't mind. I've been living off of savings for a while, trying to figure out what to do with myself. Savings don't last forever though, so I'm actually starting a programming job next week.

I originally thought I would learn something new instead of programming, but then I started working on this and got caught up in all the fun. It wasn't a "business decision" of any kind :)

Re: SerenityOS – a graphical Unix-like OS for x86, with 90s aesthetics

#140

Post by Jaruzel »

AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #123
Jaruzel wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For most non-technical people, a Windows 3.1 type GUI is all they need.

Stop this. It's condescending and part of the reason no one like tech people. It's also one of the core reasons the Linux Desktop never took off: "you don't need that, you just need (simple usecase that I envisioned because it was easy)."

Really? I'd argue that Android and iOS have proven that the simpler the GUI, the easier it is for the masses to use them.

Imagine if working a car was as complicated as your average desktop OS. There would be a lot less people driving that's for sure.

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