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Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

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Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#131

Post by e1ven »

gbacon wrote: post #125
CPLX wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But outside of that structure, what gives someone the right to dictate to their neighbors what they can and can't do with their own property? This is literally the core of the concept of zoning. If you don't like it work against zoning laws, but there's generally a consensus on the broader topic here.

koboll is almost certainly familiar with the concept of zoning. Your reply is non-responsive to the question.

His post doesn't give that impression.

"But outside of that structure, what gives someone the right to dictate to their neighbors what they can and can't do with their own property?"

Zoning. Literally, most cities and towns have laws about where someone can run a hotel. A huge number of AirBNB rentals are highly illegal.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#132

Post by duxup »

dcosson wrote: post #113
duxup wrote: post #26

I lived a few doors down to someone who basically ran an ad hoc AirBnB ... before Airbnb. It was pretty terrible. Parties all the time, trash, they parked anywhere (in other people's driveways...) because there were likely no long term consequences for doing so, the folks staying there didn't care because why should they? I was on the association board, it's kinda thankless job as we had to deal with this house. We g…

I mean, this just sounds to me like a pitch for AirBnB. They managed to solve this exact problem you're complaining about via the rating system and guests being attached to their real identity. The vast majority of AirBnB guests are very respectful and reasonable. As for your tight local control, fuck that. No, you shouldn't get to decide exactly what happens in your neighborhood just because you got there first. You…

>As for your tight local control, fuck that. No, you shouldn't get to decide exactly what happens in your neighborhood just because you got there first.

That's right I don't get to decide because I was there first.

I get to decide because the majority elected me to the association and I carried out their will. I was a representative of the neighborhood and the neighborhood got to decide.

I say "get" but I'm not there anymore, so I don't get to anymore.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#133

Post by e1ven »

Juliate wrote: post #62
koboll wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>In the end it was just a horrible situation to open up what was a hotel, right in the middle of our association / neighborhood. By joining a HOA, you've delegated away to the collective the right to dictate to your neighbors what they can and can't do with their own property. In your case, the system worked - because you are in a HOA. If people want to exert that kind of collectivist control over their neighbors, th…

> But outside of that structure, what gives someone the right to dictate to their neighbors what they can and can't do with their own property? Ha. Don't come in Europe cities. There _are_ regulations in cities about that. And rightly so.

American cities have lots of regulations about this as well.

AirBnB is making it easier for individual people to ignore these rules, and the to date enforcement hasn't been particularly strong.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#134

Post by Balgair »

jak92 wrote: post #4

Just look at the havoc being reigned on some neighborhoods in Miami Beach during spring break. Specifically the low-scale, residential flamingo park neighborhood of south beach.

In Australia, they have a similar situation and their response to it has been equally mixed. Australia's drinking age is 18, and as such, many high school students will celebrate the end of formal schooling with a week long party known as Schoolies.

Surfer's Paradise and the Gold Coast saw >40k students in 2011, about 10% of the total number of graduates, and the event is gaining in popularity. Other locations also see a large influx of young adults reveling together one last time before life comes at them. Many of these beach towns have had a pull-and-tug relationship with the event and short-term rentals have always been a part of it.

So, the issue is not AirBnB and it's effects. It's that young people tend to be inconsiderate.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0309380/

https://www.schoolies.com/what-is-schoolies

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schoolies_week

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#135

Post by DoreenMichele »

Tsubasachan wrote: post #98
duxup wrote: post #26

I lived a few doors down to someone who basically ran an ad hoc AirBnB ... before Airbnb. It was pretty terrible. Parties all the time, trash, they parked anywhere (in other people's driveways...) because there were likely no long term consequences for doing so, the folks staying there didn't care because why should they? I was on the association board, it's kinda thankless job as we had to deal with this house. We g…

AirBNB ain't disrupting shit. Flop houses and illegal hotels have existed before. Silicon Valley doesn't do history ofcourse so they think that it is all new. As you say the laws to destroy them already exist, all it takes is the effort to use it.

I don't think AirBnB remotely fits the notion of a 'flophouse.'

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flophouse

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#136

Post by szggzs27 »

dcosson wrote: post #113
duxup wrote: post #26

I lived a few doors down to someone who basically ran an ad hoc AirBnB ... before Airbnb. It was pretty terrible. Parties all the time, trash, they parked anywhere (in other people's driveways...) because there were likely no long term consequences for doing so, the folks staying there didn't care because why should they? I was on the association board, it's kinda thankless job as we had to deal with this house. We g…

I mean, this just sounds to me like a pitch for AirBnB. They managed to solve this exact problem you're complaining about via the rating system and guests being attached to their real identity. The vast majority of AirBnB guests are very respectful and reasonable. As for your tight local control, fuck that. No, you shouldn't get to decide exactly what happens in your neighborhood just because you got there first. You…

>They managed to solve this exact problem you're complaining about via the rating system and guests being attached to their real identity

I think you got it all wrong. This is not a pitch for AirBnB. If anything, the company is creating the problem, not solving it.

>As for your tight local control, fuck that. No, you shouldn't get to decide exactly what happens in your neighborhood just because you got there first.

You're taking what OP wrote out of context and molding it to fit your simplistic thinking. There are laws to protect residential neighborhoods for a reason, and they certainly are not based on "who got here first" rule.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#137

Post by nate_meurer »

cbsks wrote: post #104
nate_meurer wrote: post #81

I run a vacation rental in a small town in the mountains of Colorado. I'm quite happy to pay the taxes the town demands. Our place is busy, and our guests make a significant impact on the town, spending a lot of money in local shops and restaurants. On the other hand, there is increased wear on city and county roads (many of which are gravel), and increased load on water, sewer, and sanitation services. Cities and co…

>On the other hand, there is increased wear on city and county roads (many of which are gravel), and increased load on water, sewer, and sanitation services. Why would renters cause more wear on those resources than full time occupants?

Great question. In my case, the home is consistently occupied by more people than would otherwise be living there full time, and they're much more active than a family of permanent residents would be. They eat out a lot, drive around the town and up mountain roads, and if they're skiiers or outdoor sports-people, they're in and out of town every day.

Guests are usually groups of blended family and friends, so there are more cars. This is true for us when we visit our own place; we often bring family or friends, and they bring more cars. The dirt road leading to our house definitely notices the traffic.

And then there's the water and trash. Bloody fucking hell vacation rental guests generate a lot of trash. I'm working on some ways to encourage reduced consumption, and I stock only recycled paper products -- toilet tissue particularly is a sore point with me. I con't believe how much toilet paper people use. It pisses me off enough that I'm playing with the idea of charging for it.

Otherwise, we've had mostly good luck with our guests. Mostly. I won't rent to anyone under 25, and I'm really strict about that. I also completely banned smoking of any kind anywhere on the property, inside or outside. These things have helped.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#138

Post by Xylakant »

dcosson wrote: post #113
duxup wrote: post #26

I lived a few doors down to someone who basically ran an ad hoc AirBnB ... before Airbnb. It was pretty terrible. Parties all the time, trash, they parked anywhere (in other people's driveways...) because there were likely no long term consequences for doing so, the folks staying there didn't care because why should they? I was on the association board, it's kinda thankless job as we had to deal with this house. We g…

I mean, this just sounds to me like a pitch for AirBnB. They managed to solve this exact problem you're complaining about via the rating system and guests being attached to their real identity. The vast majority of AirBnB guests are very respectful and reasonable. As for your tight local control, fuck that. No, you shouldn't get to decide exactly what happens in your neighborhood just because you got there first. You…

> I mean, this just sounds to me like a pitch for AirBnB. They managed to solve this exact problem you're complaining about via the rating system and guests being attached to their real identity. The vast majority of AirBnB guests are very respectful and reasonable.

Having had a AirBnB rental two floors down: no, they did not. Most guests are reasonable, but a sufficiently high number are not. Unlike a hotel there’s no way to walk up to someone and tell them to shut the party down, so you’re stuck with talking to the guests which laugh in your face (quote: we’re here to party.) or calling the police. Neither is an attractive option. You can’t just complain to AirBnB and the host won’t - if you know how to reach the host.

AirBnB does about everything to isolate themselves and their clients from complaints.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#139

Post by 8ytecoder »

dcosson wrote: post #113
duxup wrote: post #26

I lived a few doors down to someone who basically ran an ad hoc AirBnB ... before Airbnb. It was pretty terrible. Parties all the time, trash, they parked anywhere (in other people's driveways...) because there were likely no long term consequences for doing so, the folks staying there didn't care because why should they? I was on the association board, it's kinda thankless job as we had to deal with this house. We g…

I mean, this just sounds to me like a pitch for AirBnB. They managed to solve this exact problem you're complaining about via the rating system and guests being attached to their real identity. The vast majority of AirBnB guests are very respectful and reasonable. As for your tight local control, fuck that. No, you shouldn't get to decide exactly what happens in your neighborhood just because you got there first. You…

They haven’t solved that all. The rating system is between the guest and the host. When it’s the neighbors who bear the brunt. I’m usually not for too much local control or NIMBYIsm. However, this is distinctively different. Airbnb can be awful for the neighbors and they didn’t buy their place knowingly that they’d have to put up with that - what essentially is - a hotel in their midst.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#140

Post by duxup »

stuaxo wrote: post #124
duxup wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> that's the kind of organization they should be buying homes in Or maybe buy in a city that makes the decision to not allow that kind of rental? I don't see a significant difference in a step up from the association I was in where you deemed that ok, to a city making the same decision.

People should uproot and move just because AirBnB is setting up ?

Certainly they shouldn't have to.

I was just following his logic that he felt it was ok that the associating decided and that if a city decided the same, then I don't see much difference.

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