It’s better to be born rich than gifted • Hacker News Board

Re: It’s better to be born rich than gifted

#131

Post by jesssse » Sun, Oct 14, 2018, 12:57 AM UTC

jacobolus wrote: post #111

cm2012 wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Luckily, there are massively diminishing returns to money's effect on educational outcomes and overall happiness, so a dollar taxed from the rich is worth much less to them than to the poor it is given to.

Not just educational outcomes. More money has massively diminishing returns to happiness, health, fitness, longevity, creative output, ... The biggest constraint is often individual people’s time/attention; additional money is only slightly (if at all) helpful for the already rich. But a little bit of money goes a long way to help people who are not eating well, don’t have a place to live, need to work 3 stressful pa…

I do not see inheritance as a problem. My motivation for accumulating wealth is largely driven by a desire to provide for my future family members.

Inheritance tax is theft.

Re: It’s better to be born rich than gifted

#132

Post by jesssse » Sun, Oct 14, 2018, 1:00 AM UTC

RestlessMind wrote: post #105

dokein wrote: post #6

This isn’t going to be popular, but: Should parents be allowed to try to give their children a boost in life? If the answer is yes, then it follows that parents with more resources will be more able to provide that boost. For me, the line is drawn at “legacy” admissions or jobs, where a clearly lesser candidate is given the nod over someone who is more qualified. But if the parent is able to provide e.g. volunteer op…

> Should parents be allowed to try to give their children a boost in life? Like many things in social contract, the answer is - okay to a reasonable degree, but extremes should be discouraged / forbidden. Some concrete examples: annual limits on gift taxes, inheritance tax beyond a certain estate size etc. Policies which will level the playing field between rich and poor kids: - very high rate of inheritance tax beyo…

I am confused about taxes. When a person gives their family member a gift, why do you feel entitled to a portion of this private exchange of wealth?

Re: It’s better to be born rich than gifted

#133

Post by spyckie2 » Sun, Oct 14, 2018, 1:01 AM UTC

dokein wrote: post #6

This isn’t going to be popular, but: Should parents be allowed to try to give their children a boost in life? If the answer is yes, then it follows that parents with more resources will be more able to provide that boost. For me, the line is drawn at “legacy” admissions or jobs, where a clearly lesser candidate is given the nod over someone who is more qualified. But if the parent is able to provide e.g. volunteer op…

What theories of economics tell us is that favoring one party over the other for reasons that aren't utility or value derived is being inefficient with your allocation of resources, compared to a market only allocates based on how much utility is derived (a free competitive market or globally scoped decision making, I'm not sure if "free market" is even how economists view the market anymore). So the argument is that Nepotism, Nationalism, or anything that favors parties for reasons other than value / merit is seen as inefficient.

To understand this, consider this - if you're bill gates, would you rather live in a society where your just your kids are well educated, smart contributors to making the life of all humanity better, or a society where EVERYONE that has potential is well educated and smart contributors to society. If you have $100 bucks, you'd think - my limited resources is not able to do the latter, even though its better both for me and humanity as a whole to invest in everyone, so let me stick to the former. But a rational actor with infinite resources who cares about their own well being will realize that their society is only as good as everyone in it, and would push for the latter kind of resource distribution.

Of course, your goal doesn't have to be acting efficiently in a global market. It's not morally wrong to act inefficiently (although some would have you think it is).

Re: It’s better to be born rich than gifted

#134

Post by shaklee3 » Sun, Oct 14, 2018, 1:02 AM UTC

jesssse wrote: post #132

RestlessMind wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Should parents be allowed to try to give their children a boost in life? Like many things in social contract, the answer is - okay to a reasonable degree, but extremes should be discouraged / forbidden. Some concrete examples: annual limits on gift taxes, inheritance tax beyond a certain estate size etc. Policies which will level the playing field between rich and poor kids: - very high rate of inheritance tax beyo…

I am confused about taxes. When a person gives their family member a gift, why do you feel entitled to a portion of this private exchange of wealth?

I think the point is that if you can hand down a lot of wealth to your kids, they are already on a different playing field than other kids. it's fine to transfer wealth, but the way things are today means that that wealth can be used to buy a better education.

Re: It’s better to be born rich than gifted

#135

Post by jstewartmobile » Sun, Oct 14, 2018, 1:04 AM UTC

For every silver spoon who flies through higher-ed to the gilded cage at the end of the rainbow, there are several more left back home--still living under daddy's shadow--duking it out with the others for a bigger share of the corpse.

Sometimes, we need adversity. Not so much for our bank accounts as for our souls.

Re: It’s better to be born rich than gifted

#136

Post by jwatte » Sun, Oct 14, 2018, 1:05 AM UTC

dokein wrote: post #6

This isn’t going to be popular, but: Should parents be allowed to try to give their children a boost in life? If the answer is yes, then it follows that parents with more resources will be more able to provide that boost. For me, the line is drawn at “legacy” admissions or jobs, where a clearly lesser candidate is given the nod over someone who is more qualified. But if the parent is able to provide e.g. volunteer op…

Could society benefit if more people had these opportunities?

Re: It’s better to be born rich than gifted

#137

Post by golemiprague » Sun, Oct 14, 2018, 1:05 AM UTC

romed wrote: post #36

deleteme12345 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A complete fuck up by objective standards? That's the most subjective thing I've heard so far. Everyone that has worked with him has praised him. What are you smoking?

The ABA downgraded him in 2005 from "well qualified" to "qualified", then in 2018 said that his confirmation to the Supreme Court was not in the best interests of the legal profession or the Association. Those are certainly the people who worked most closely with him. Objectively, you'd want to find one of the top handful of legal scholars in America to serve on the court. Kavanaugh is not one of those people. He has…

What's wrong with having a fight? It actually shows that he didn't grow up in some sterile middle class suburb but actually was exposed to all walks of life. I was in a fight when I was 19, didn't affect my life at all, what kind of person are you to even think a fight in your teenage years suppose to mean anything?

Re: It’s better to be born rich than gifted

#138

Post by jwatte » Sun, Oct 14, 2018, 1:07 AM UTC

jesssse wrote: post #130

dahart wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But to a certain extent it is zero-sum. It is not zero-sum, there is not a fixed amount of wealth in either the US economy nor the global economy. If we educated everyone, and everyone with potential reached their potential and contributed to the economy, we can all have more wealth. It’s not a requirement that someone lose, and this is what I meant by a return of two dollars for every dollar spent. > The way you b…

College is already overpriced because of government subsidies. Your plan would make it worse.

Not actually true, except under very skewed systems and assumptions.

Re: It’s better to be born rich than gifted

#139

Post by jwatte » Sun, Oct 14, 2018, 1:09 AM UTC

jesssse wrote: post #131

jacobolus wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just educational outcomes. More money has massively diminishing returns to happiness, health, fitness, longevity, creative output, ... The biggest constraint is often individual people’s time/attention; additional money is only slightly (if at all) helpful for the already rich. But a little bit of money goes a long way to help people who are not eating well, don’t have a place to live, need to work 3 stressful pa…

I do not see inheritance as a problem. My motivation for accumulating wealth is largely driven by a desire to provide for my future family members. Inheritance tax is theft.

Not paying taxes is theft from the society that lets you accumulate and keep wealth.

Re: It’s better to be born rich than gifted

#140

Post by _8j50 » Sun, Oct 14, 2018, 1:09 AM UTC

dokein wrote: post #6

This isn’t going to be popular, but: Should parents be allowed to try to give their children a boost in life? If the answer is yes, then it follows that parents with more resources will be more able to provide that boost. For me, the line is drawn at “legacy” admissions or jobs, where a clearly lesser candidate is given the nod over someone who is more qualified. But if the parent is able to provide e.g. volunteer op…

Of course they should be allowed,the only line I would draw is to not let the boosting cripple your child. You would rob the child perseverance and many life lessons if you don't let him/het fight for their share of the figurative pie.