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The rich world needs higher real wage growth

economist.com

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Re: The rich world needs higher real wage growth

#131

Post by CamTin »

dominotw wrote: post #62
gedy wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably because it does not translate into food, health, and shelter security for the vast majority of people.

sure if you don't have those already, I am sure gp does have food, healthcare. I was curious if better tech makes your richer if you already have food, healthcare, security covered. Richer doesn't necessarily mean we have more food than before.

It should mean that we have better security in all of those things. Any increase in "wealth" that doesn't actually make us better off in the sense that we are less likely to lack necessary things like food, healthcare, and shelter is not really a kind of wealth worth having. All but the most very very rich people in the US are just a couple bad breaks away from homelessness, poverty, and lack of reasonable health insurance. It's better elsewhere but the safety net is not immutable and many many people want to dismantle it for shallow political reasons.

Re: The rich world needs higher real wage growth

#132

Post by AngryData »

slg wrote: post #89
phkahler wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My phone has the capability of a billion dollars worth of super computers back in the 1980s. Its not sensible to assign any economic value to that. I'm not richer because I have better technology today than before. Trasistors have just suffered massive commoditization and their prices reflect that.

It isn't just tech like phones and laptops. Cars for example are one of the biggest purchases that people make and increased quality has resulted in them staying on the road 50% longer than they did a couple decades ago. In that case, looking at the nominal cost of the car doesn't tell you nearly enough about inflation. The actual cost measured by miles driven or years owned has dropped drastically. You might not be…

A bit of a tangent but I don't think cars last any longer than a decade or two ago, certain models sure but 90s cars can hit 300K+ miles with normal maintenance. A car from 2010 or newer isn't going to be any better off at 300K miles though and would likely be even more costly to maintain because of all the added and unnecessary features combined with penny pinching parts and materials until they are just barely adequate. Plus parts in general for newer vehicles are usually much more expensive for no good reason. A rack and pinion for my 25 year old truck is $250 and are still produced, a rack and pinion for 5 year old model of the same truck costs $1000, but there is no real difference on the mechanics on how it works and an old one could easily be adapted to fit the newer model in like 45 minutes.

Re: The rich world needs higher real wage growth

#133

Post by walshemj »

ben_w wrote: post #41
mozumder wrote: post #6

Or better yet, reduce prices all around. Think of all your expenses and look at ways to systematically reduce them for everyone. Start with food, get a meal down to less than a dollar. Rent is high because everyone wants to move to certain dense areas, while moving away from more spacious/rural areas. This is unsustainable. Offer incentives for people to move elsewhere, including jobs programs and subsidizing mass tr…

> Start with food, get a meal down to less than a dollar. I know food prices vary a lot from place to place, but in the UK right now (at current exchange rates) you could eat for a bit over $1 per day, never mind per meal. I’ll grant you that’s student meals, a balanced mixture of rice lentils and vegetables, but it’s all your protein, vitamin and caloric needs.

1$ is 75p and I doubt that you can have a fully balanced meal on just rice and vegetables or th at you could do this for 75P double it to 1.50 maybe but wouldn't be a very good long term diet.

Re: The rich world needs higher real wage growth

#134

Post by phkahler »

slg wrote: post #89
phkahler wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My phone has the capability of a billion dollars worth of super computers back in the 1980s. Its not sensible to assign any economic value to that. I'm not richer because I have better technology today than before. Trasistors have just suffered massive commoditization and their prices reflect that.

It isn't just tech like phones and laptops. Cars for example are one of the biggest purchases that people make and increased quality has resulted in them staying on the road 50% longer than they did a couple decades ago. In that case, looking at the nominal cost of the car doesn't tell you nearly enough about inflation. The actual cost measured by miles driven or years owned has dropped drastically. You might not be…

That just means I spend less money cars. All thing else being equal I should have more disposable income. Just like the phone example I can say cars are cheaper now. No sense trying to assign mythical extra value to them outside real dollar transactions.

Re: The rich world needs higher real wage growth

#135

Post by oriol16 »

Animats wrote: post #100

The emphasis on oil may reflect a European perspective. Only 19% of US oil is imported now, and the US generates very little electricity from oil. The US is a natural gas exporter. If the US wants energy independence, it's within reach. At the other extreme, Japan imports essentially all its oil, as does the UK. Both import most of their natural gas.

US burns 20mbd and produces less than 10mbd. Are you sure imports are only 19%?

Re: The rich world needs higher real wage growth

#136

Post by mozumder »

ben_w wrote: post #45
mozumder wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because people need to be located where they are most efficiently utilized in the economy. Everyone wants to live in New York or San Francisco, but the jobs are going to be distributed around the country. How are people going to construct a bridge in Ohio if everyone is in New York City? Jobs are still a local thing.

If everyone lived in New York or San Francisco, there wouldn’t be any need to construct a bridge in Ohio in exactly the same way there’s no need to build one over the Onyx River in Antarctica.

Doesn't work that way, since jobs are independent of labor pool location.

A good example would be tourism, where companies draw people to places with no population.

Also, companies that decide to build a factory in the middle of nowhere to take advantage of something else, like cheaper land or electricity.

And suddenly you need to build a bridge in Ohio to get to that factory.

Re: The rich world needs higher real wage growth

#137

Post by superbaconman »

j-c-hewitt wrote: post #90
dalbasal wrote: post #56

This article really demonstrates how meaningless most economics reporting is, it's nearly as bad as markets/finance reporting. Oil is $75, about average over the last decade. It has almost nothing to do with employment, wage growth or GDP except inasmuch as all major economic measures affect eachother. A year ago oil prices were low, did that mean the opposite of this article (whatever that is) was true? This kind of…

Someone's gotta explain to me what "structural changes in the economy" means. Does it mean that the economy is like a big building and we added another floor? Is the economy now like one of those whacky nu-architecture prizewinning buildings that are shaped like giant globs of play-do? Or is it one of those phrases that can be used to mean absolutely anything at all?

Probably changes to finance law. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Financial_law

Re: The rich world needs higher real wage growth

#138

Post by notananthem »

Real wage growth is stagnant because of shit like brexit and trump's trade wars. Companies can afford to provide real wage growth but are being conservative because idiots who don't understand simple macroeconomics keep shooting their economies in the foot.

Brexit particularly is a good example of keeping a monty python esque giant foot down on real wage growth.

Re: The rich world needs higher real wage growth

#139

Post by tcbawo »

baursak wrote: post #96
dalbasal wrote: post #56

This article really demonstrates how meaningless most economics reporting is, it's nearly as bad as markets/finance reporting. Oil is $75, about average over the last decade. It has almost nothing to do with employment, wage growth or GDP except inasmuch as all major economic measures affect eachother. A year ago oil prices were low, did that mean the opposite of this article (whatever that is) was true? This kind of…

Relevant: https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/1991/10/-quot... "The magazine is written by young people pretending to be old people... If American readers got a look at the pimply complexions of their economic gurus, they would cancel their subscriptions in droves."

If American readers knew the track record of most economic gurus, they would cancel their subscriptions and demand a refund.

Re: The rich world needs higher real wage growth

#140

Post by mc32 »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #73
dalbasal wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have (more than a little dusty) degree in economics, and I still don't understand what this article is trying to tell me. Is it telling me that when unemployment is low, central bank policy is to raise interest rates? If so, why not say that? What I meant is that generally I don't see how the sentences in this article add up to .. an article. It's a bunch of metrics, chosen by convention, expressed in cliche. It ki…

> Is it telling me that when unemployment is low, central bank policy is to raise interest rates? If so, why not say that? Raising rates aren’t the only way to solve the problem of (a) people who could be in the labour market but aren’t and (b) insufficient labour in the places it needs to be. Whatever it’s trying to do, it got me thinking about barriers to hiring in New York City. Are there steps we could eliminate…

I'm curious to see how far she goes with her esposal of Chavista policies and if she does, what its impact will be on the community.
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