China must be split up. It's a huge population and it's not working.
Hello https://youtu.be/0vVOXlgHC1U?t=37m5s
For those that don't watch the YouTube, it shows a long Chinese military parade, which suggests the unlikelihood of China splitting up.
China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other
131–140 of 273 posts
Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other
#132As a European I hope we find the courage and the strength to allow ourselves to be militarized as we where at the beginning of the 20th century. I think to a certain degree a military conflict with China would not be a bad thing. Here we have achived quite a few things of which each of his own would be worth dying for.
Typical western values are seriously underrated and are not taken seriously.
Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other
#133The economist and other media love pointing fingers at others. That's easy to do. Everyone knows China is not a democracy but we are which makes surveillance here much more problematic.
Yet we do not see any serious examination from the economist on threats to democracy from surveillance. Infact it is at the forefront on hit pieces on Snowden accusing him of treachery [1] which means their concern for 'surveillance' is entirely fabricated.
Why is Assange still stranded and Snowden in Russia? What consequences has there been from the revelations on western security services and rubber stamp courts? No answer from the economist because they aren't even asking the question. Yet another cheap ploy to use 'human rights', 'democracy' and 'freedom' to attack other countries while soiling these principles.
The economist is a principal cheerleader of neoliberalism, shock therapy and other exploitative economic policies that directly lead to corruption, theft of national resources by uncontrolled privatization and oligarchies in third world countries. Nothing to do with democracy.
This kind of hypocrisy and grandstanding has run its course, its a dangerous distraction designed to lull readers into complacency while entrenched interests that publications like the economist support make democracy more and more meaningless.
[1] https://www.economist.com/democracy-in-america/2014/01/10/tr...
Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other
#134Earlier quoted context omitted.
Doesn't make his point any less valid in this PARTICULAR context. I mean, where are we going to move the factories if the prerequisite is "No brutal use of deadly force against Muslims" ?
Was he making a relevant point besides that the West/US has done bad things too?
So then we might as well just leave the factories in China then?
Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other
#135I think we, as the world, need to counter this by 1.) Start moving factories out China, back into your local country. It could be an upgrade for companies to upgrade to more automated factories. Furthermore, it fights against China's agenda of 'Made in China in 2025', which they expect to make....everything in China. 2.) Shame companies that are investing further in China, destroying jobs in your local country. 3.) S…
I agree but how should this actually work? I feel like we have no options here. Everything comes from China, beginning with my mobile devices.
Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other
#136In the West we have a false sense of security that totalitarianism will inevitably fail. We've seen so many examples of fallen tyrannical states. But many ideas fail the first few times they're tried. China seems committed to making totalitarianism "work." It's hard to think of any more dangerous invention. Even nuclear weapons aren't as dangerous as a sustainable model for modern tyrannical government. This is an in…
I very much doubt it is sustainable. The cost of policing is quite substantial and the productivity lost is hard to replace which adds to the cost. What we are seeing today is essentially a low intensity conflict[0] not unlike what took place in white Rhodesia/Namibia, Northern Ireland during the troubles, etc. There is a economic reason why these conflicts could not last indefinitely, no matter what ideologies drive…
> I very much doubt it is sustainable.
What if you're wrong? You have doubts, where's the evidence?
> What we are seeing today is essentially a low intensity conflict
This part I don't see at all. Who are the sides in this low intensity conflict? The examples in Wikipedia are distinct identities or states. What identities are in contention in China?
Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other
#137In the West we have a false sense of security that totalitarianism will inevitably fail. We've seen so many examples of fallen tyrannical states. But many ideas fail the first few times they're tried. China seems committed to making totalitarianism "work." It's hard to think of any more dangerous invention. Even nuclear weapons aren't as dangerous as a sustainable model for modern tyrannical government. This is an in…
> In the West we have a false sense of security that totalitarianism will inevitably fail.
At the height of civil war the western classical liberal democracies looked weak and near collapse while Soviet looked too strong and awesome until one day it just collapsed. It is a bubble boy vs Sewer Rat thing. The bubble boy looks extremely clean and insulated from bad things until one day it just dies of common cold. The filthy NY sewer rat however survives carrying in itself 10 different types of plagues.
> China seems committed to making totalitarianism "work."
We need to take a backseat and realise that American media simply does not get China, India or Japan. They are judging the world from their own spectacles which might be wrong. An average Chinese today is freerer than an average Chinese 30 years ago despite all efforts by their government. An average American today is less free than an average American 30 years ago.
I am incredible hopeful for India and China in upcoming efforts. I recently spoke to a Chinese attache at local embassy. He was as ecstatic to be outside China as now he could access Youtube and Facebook. He considered his own government moves to ban these services in his country absolutely stupid and saw them as a hindrance to help China emerge as a soft power.
Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other
#138In the West we have a false sense of security that totalitarianism will inevitably fail. We've seen so many examples of fallen tyrannical states. But many ideas fail the first few times they're tried. China seems committed to making totalitarianism "work." It's hard to think of any more dangerous invention. Even nuclear weapons aren't as dangerous as a sustainable model for modern tyrannical government. This is an in…
I very much doubt it is sustainable. The cost of policing is quite substantial and the productivity lost is hard to replace which adds to the cost. What we are seeing today is essentially a low intensity conflict[0] not unlike what took place in white Rhodesia/Namibia, Northern Ireland during the troubles, etc. There is a economic reason why these conflicts could not last indefinitely, no matter what ideologies drive…
> I very much doubt it is sustainable. The cost of policing is quite substantial and the productivity lost is hard to replace which adds to the cost.
Why do you think the Chinese government can't sustain the cost? Intensive policing is manpower intensive, and China presently has manpower to spare. They also don't have to deal with democratic pressures to contain the cost and redirect the savings to programs that benefit the general public.
Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other
#139Earlier quoted context omitted.
"We've slowly dispelled Christian fervor" is an incredibly misinformed take. Christian fundamentalists are still well armed and causing trouble in the United States on a regular basis, even if the Crusades haven't happened in a while. The death toll is sizable. Big names in evangelical culture with TV air time or even visits to the White House also trumpet on a regular basis that the end times are near, blood will ne…
What is this death toll you speak of? Can you be more concrete?
2008-2016:
"115 right-wing inspired terror incidents. 35% of these were foiled (meaning no attack happened) and 29% resulted in fatalities. These terror incidents caused 79 deaths.
"63 Islamist inspired terror incidents. 76% of these were foiled (meaning no attack happened) and 13% resulted in fatalities. These terror incidents caused 90 deaths.
"19 incidents inspired by left-wing ideologies (including eco-terrorism). 20% of these were foiled (meaning no attack happened) and 10% resulted in fatalities. These terror incidents caused 7 deaths."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_in_the_United_States...
https://www.theinvestigativefund.org/investigation/2017/06/2...
Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other
#140I keep telling people about this and their unconcerned reactions really worry me.
What exactly should they be concerned about? It's not as if they have even the thinnest possibility of having any impact on such things. There are more important things for them to worry about.