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Words for “yes” in Romance languages

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Re: Words for “yes” in Romance languages

#131

Post by YeGoblynQueenne »

bartread wrote: post #112
YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Greece we had a writer called Nikos Tsiforos whose schtick was exactly that. He wrote entire history and mythology books in a Greek argot (the language of the "manges" and the rebetika, which you probably won't find about on the 'net). He used the slang of a criminal subculture that was full of profanity, sarcasm and disdain for authority and polite society to treat scholarly subjects like the Francocracy, the Con…

This idea isn't particularly new: even the New Testament is written in what was basically street Greek rather than the more formal variant usually employed for written documents.

The language in the New Testament is not formal, yes, but it's not "street Greek" in the same sense that we mean "street speak" today. At the time, Greek was the lingua franca of that part of the world, basically the Roman empire, so it was used by people who didn't have another common language to communicate in their daily interactions. It's not a slang though, nor a subculture's secret argot.

For instance, today the de facto lingua franca spoken around the world is English. So, if the New Testament was written today- it would be obviously written in English to reach the broadest audience possible.

Now, imagine if the apostles decided to write about Christ's life not just in English, but in the kind of English used in gangsta rap. I have read the New Testament in the original and I can assure you that is not what it sounds like :)

Re: Words for “yes” in Romance languages

#132

Post by YeGoblynQueenne »

gkya wrote: post #101
YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

French people also nod upwards to say "no". This is just one swift nod, not an up-and-down nod, and it's usually accompanied by a quick drawn-in breath. I've never seen that anywhere else. My friends who did that were Occitan btw. so maybe it's not all of France.

In Turkey we have raised eyebrows for a no, often denoting also some sort of pity/empathy if the lips are squeezed into a half-smile form (sometimes this is accompanied by a slow bobbing of the head).

I think I know the expression, yes :)

Re: Words for “yes” in Romance languages

#133

Post by techolic »

Vinnl wrote: post #76
EB-Barrington wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Albanians (like Bulgaria, Albania shares a border with Greece) also nod up and down for no, and turn their heads left-to-right for yes. As in Bulgaria, this is not universal throughout the populace - making it all the more confusing when you come across it during conversation. Related: in Albanian, yes is "po", no is "jo".

It's even worse that some of them compensate when you're a tourist, nodding for yes and shaking their heads for no. But you can't know whether they're doing that.

For some reason I'm thinking game theory now.

Re: Words for “yes” in Romance languages

#134

Post by esra »

MayeulC wrote: post #116

> So they combined hoc with ille, which means “that” (but also comes to just mean “he”: compare Spanish el, Italian il, French le, and so on) Well, I have to disagree on this bit. French for "he" is actually "il"; while "le" is "the". If you are more interested, "that" would be "ce", or if you want to stress it/be more accurate, "cela" (can be contracted to "ça"), or "celui-là" -- literally "that him there" -- while…

To be more specific, "le" is masculine "the", but can also mean him, "Je le vois" => "I see him".

Re: Words for “yes” in Romance languages

#135

Post by cryptonector »

kiliancs wrote: post #29

It's interesting that in Catalan you may say oi [0] in addition to sí. It is more commonly used in questions and to answer such questions. For example: Plou molt, oi? Oi. There's a construct that is very common and redundant: oi que sí? == right that yes?, which would be translated as an emphatic "right?" [0] http://mdlc.iec.cat/results.asp?txtEntrada=Oi&operEntrada=0

"Oi que sí" in Spanish is a lot like "oy, yeah" in English. The "oi" is not "this" or "yeah", it's "oy, I already told you".

Now, "oí, que sí" is different: "hear me: yes", but maybe only in Argentina/Uruguay, where imperatives are constructed differently than elsewhere in the Spanish-speaking world. "Oí" deriving from "oid", which is the second person plural imperative in proper Spanish -- just drop the 'd', keep the stress on the 'i', and use it as the second person singular imperative (this is the formula for all second person singular imperatives down there).

Re: Words for “yes” in Romance languages

#136

Post by schoen »

posterboy wrote: post #121
schoen wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wonder, is occitan not related to occident and orient? Nope! The orient is where the sun rises and the occident is where the sun sets. All of these have been traced back to Proto-Indo-European and have different origins: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/orior#Latin https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/occido#Etymology_1 https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/ob#Latin https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/hic#Latin Edit: the eu- also ha…

Yeah, I can google myself thank you very much. Your inability to speak or to read properly makes me really doubt your general premises, because neither had anyone talked about ob and you didn't explain the relation to the thread either, nor did you notice my precaution to note that I the theory for oil from the article might still be valid. Instead you seem to have come panting and frothing from the mouth as soon as…

> To repeat, what's "ob" have to do with this?

Ob is the prefix that combined with cado to produce occido, which is the origin of occident. The assimilation of the b to the initial consonant of the other verb is something that's been seen in a large number of other cases.

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Category:Latin_words_prefixed...

Re: Words for “yes” in Romance languages

#137

Post by cryptonector »

pera wrote: post #30
lbebber wrote: post #12

Interesting. In (Brazilian) Portuguese, "isso" and "isso aí" ("this", "this there") is used to confirm or agree with something, so it seems the expression survived the times.

I always thought it was some kind of contraction of "isso e certo". The same expression also exist in Spanish.

Same with the "this" reply that's so in vogue online in English: "this [is the correct answer]".

Re: Words for “yes” in Romance languages

#138

Post by cryptonector »

posterboy wrote: post #45

I wonder, is occitan not related to occident and orient? and oil, well, that's norse for beer, remember where normandy has it's name from? That doesn't explain yes, no; but eu, as in euphemism might[1]. Heureka! In other news, what does si in greek letters look like? "σι"! Pretty close to oi nowadays and Celtic druids are speculated to have visited Greece. That doesn't invalidate the "this there" story, but maybe pre…

I didn't take it as disdain exactly. More like a meant-to-be-funny turn, almost self-deprecating. I doubt the author actually feels disdain for slavic languages.

Re: Words for “yes” in Romance languages

#139

Post by cryptonector »

Slavic wrote: post #126
mjfisher wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've become increasingly interested in how people become offended recently. Offence tends to be bound up in notions of identity, and I think the way people offend and become offended is increasingly a factor in a world becoming more polarised. Would you be able to expand a little on your feelings? Would you expect people from other cultures mentioned in the article to be similarly offended? I'm not asking you to just…

Thank you for your kind asking. When I had started with this article I literally stopped reading at said phrase. I guess my intetion by posting this comment on HN and not continuing reading was to show my disapproval with said phrase. I assume the author mixed his interesting article with humour in order to appeal to a broader audience. And as it goes with humour there is always someone or something being criticized…

I took your top-post as meant to be funny, because of your username; I laughed anyways.

Similarly, I took the author's "disdain" for slavic as not-real, but rather a meant-to-be-funny turn to avoid a detour into Romanian as the point of TFA was ultimately that the yeses in Romance languages generally derive from something like "this".

I am rather surprised you truly felt offended.

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