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The tech sec­tor might be evil

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Re: The tech sec­tor might be evil

#131

Post by d_theorist »

throwaway613834 wrote: post #82
kelnos wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 3. The question is not whether something can be used for "evil", but whether it is. If it is, ideally people shouldn't be contributing to it. This is difficult, though. If a thing is used for evil, but also for good, where do you draw the line and say the bad is outweighing the good and the thing has to go?

> This is difficult, though. If a thing is used for evil, but also for good, where do you draw the line and say the bad is outweighing the good and the thing has to go? That's secondary to the question I'm asking. The question I'm asking is how to even bring up the topic in the first place. If I can get that far I think I've already done pretty well.

My advice would be to start by ditching the word 'evil'. It's ambiguous, and has religious connotations that probably only serve to confuse rather than clarify. Try describing your issues with these companies in more precise terms.

Re: The tech sec­tor might be evil

#132

Post by Sean1708 »

> It no­tably in­volves the M-word

This might be a horrendously stupid question, but what is the "M-word"? The only m-word introduced up until that point is "moment" but that's obviously not it. I was thinking maybe Microsoft, but they then go on to talk about Facebook, Amazon, and Google.

Edit: OK that was a very stupid question, I should have read to the end of the article first.

Re: The tech sec­tor might be evil

#133

Post by humanrebar »

Sean1708 wrote: post #132

> It no­tably in­volves the M-word This might be a horrendously stupid question, but what is the "M-word"? The only m-word introduced up until that point is "moment" but that's obviously not it. I was thinking maybe Microsoft, but they then go on to talk about Facebook, Amazon, and Google. Edit: OK that was a very stupid question, I should have read to the end of the article first.

> The M-Word -- It’s “Monopoly” of course.

From the article, farther down.

Re: The tech sec­tor might be evil

#134

Post by calsy »

Most in the tech professions are progressive and liberal, is that so... Just because people might work in Silicon Valley doesn't mean they automatically align with that "way of thinking".

Re: The tech sec­tor might be evil

#135

Post by jhugg »

calsy wrote: post #134

Most in the tech professions are progressive and liberal, is that so... Just because people might work in Silicon Valley doesn't mean they automatically align with that "way of thinking".

That’s why he said “most” and not “all”.

Re: The tech sec­tor might be evil

#136

Post by mrtksn »

cyberpunk0 wrote: post #130
mrtksn wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Twitter is the medium about what's happening RIGHT NOW. In before you would open the TV or the radio to get information about what's happening right now but these days many people would look at Titter to get information about "RIGHT NOW". It could be mundane things about the lives of other people or it could be an event that's affecting large number of people. If something is happening, there would be reports of obse…

Arguably it's a medium for unimportant things happening right now. anecdotal but I see maybe 1% useful tweets and 99% garbage.

The TV is also criticised for low quality content but still it is a fundamental medium and the way it is managed is regarded as a basic benchmark for democracies.

Re: The tech sec­tor might be evil

#137

Post by 3131s »

taway_1212 wrote: post #110
geomark wrote: post #21

Not to mention the many (ex) friends working for "defense" contractors. Ex because I really can't be friends with them any longer. Evil quotes deployed because calling it defense is a farce considering what the systems they are developing are used for.

I never understood the disdain for working in the arms sector. After all, weapons are just tools, it's the politicians who decide what to do with them. You should despise the king, not the gunsmith.

Just like the guy pulling the lever in the gas chamber.

Re: The tech sec­tor might be evil

#139

Post by taway_1212 »

3131s wrote: post #137
taway_1212 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood the disdain for working in the arms sector. After all, weapons are just tools, it's the politicians who decide what to do with them. You should despise the king, not the gunsmith.

Just like the guy pulling the lever in the gas chamber.

There's a big difference though. A country without a solid defence sector is not really sovereign - it has to buy its weapons from other countries, which can cut the supply at any time, or just refuse to sell you current-gen tech altogether.

There simply would be no USA without its defense sector - it is essential to its existence. Citizens of other countries (France, UK, Sweden etc.) understand that and you don't hear them dumping on their defense companies. It's pretty much only Americans who are so out of touch with the realities of the world that they think weapons are evil and rest of the world will just leave them be (even if they can't defend themselves).

Re: The tech sec­tor might be evil

#140

Post by ThrowawayR2 »

microtonal wrote: post #26
throwaway613834 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I know. But it's also true that if they tried to do the opposite of what they were told (or if they just refused) then they'd get fired. So what do you do?

Just stop pretending that working at {Google, Facebook, Amazon, ...} is the highest goal that a tech person can strife for. A see a lot of students who seem to have that as their goal in life. Also, we have to be honest with ourselves. While we (as a community) were hating Microsoft, we made Google our tech darling. Now they are ethically probably as rotten as Microsoft were in the early ~2000s. We should stop puttin…

> Just stop pretending that working at {Google, Facebook, Amazon, ...} is the highest goal that a tech person can strife for. A see a lot of students who seem to have that as their goal in life.

It's not, you have to admit, a terrible goal. Granted, a lot of the people at the big 4 do rather mundane things but there are also opportunities at those places to build software that (literally) affects the whole world and leave lasting contributions to the software engineering field for those with the talent and drive.

> Also, we have to be honest with ourselves. While we (as a community) were hating Microsoft, we made Google our tech darling. Now they are ethically probably as rotten as Microsoft were in the early ~2000s.

I'm incredibly amused to see people starting to say this because I've been around enough to remember when IBM was the "ethically rotten" behemoth and Microsoft was the tech darling who saved us from their evil clutches; the more things change, the more they stay the same. I don't think people will stop putting companies on a pedestal; it makes for too compelling a narrative.

Who will be the new tech darling to save us from Google's evil clutches?

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